La Louve Blanche - kennel - Page 2

furyos · 25-01-2007, 14:08

hi wolfin y have little problem with my pc now y try to write yu tonight...frank

wolfin · 25-01-2007, 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by furyos

hi wolfin y have little problem with my pc now y try to write yu tonight...frank

ok, i am waiting

furyos · 25-01-2007, 20:10

hi again ...y hope my mail go now because y have little pb today ....well ...if y understand yur awnser and yur question yu want to know my opinion for breeding ?of course wolfdogs are not christmass tree and decoration is not the most important (but it ' s yu that yu write 35 shows)....y just explain why y try and do now show.....when y go to hungria to visit edit's kennel y fall really in love about cryingwolf merlin....(y know that it s so subjectiv)and when y ask about edit y want to bye him she say straightly and definitly NO!!!!!!!!!!!!(merlin is adult and she keep him for her)but like a kid y stay a long time in the hungria snow with basket shoos(yu can imagine the situation) and y do a promise...:to export the quality of merlin to france and his of course do show...../............(next in few minutes)

furyos · 25-01-2007, 20:28

and edit say ok ...little as little he win some show and have good comment but the truth y don't(and he don't) like so much show...but promise is promise!!!.....do yu know a lot of dogs( if we can talk with them ) prefered show than stay at home quiet or go to walk in hood with masters ....this is for show my opinion ....for work

f course y know that wolfdog are created for work (and it's in the standard)but it s the same if we have all human and dogs the CHOICE ....what we prefered ?vavations of course !!!!!!!!!!and FREEDOM like wolf or other savage animals ...this for work but y understand dogs work but y think it s so good too when people keep their dogs in family life too...before all dogs are selected for work(ex of caniche is typical) and little as little they love them like kids or best friends and it s so normal attitude...nobody can change that ...BUT the DANGER is people do confusion between dogs and things ...and put them in REFUGE ....that is criminal and not responsible attitude!!!!!!!!!!!!!!this is my opinion for work ....well y hope yu understand me and convictions too ....friendly ...frank

wolfin · 25-01-2007, 20:34

Furyos, sorry but i WOULD like information about Ossa. She do NOT have x-rays and have puppies.

furyos · 25-01-2007, 21:29

hi !!!.yes merlin is ok and all parent s ossa are hd B/B ..y wait the awsers about professor genevois(fci specialist) but my vetenary who take radio tell me he don t see bad things but it s not official yet ....BUT do yu know that 2 parents hd A/A can give C or D result ....it s not a guaranty it' just a precaution ...and 2 international dogs can give very bad looking dogs too ........y repeat a gain the PERFECTION NEVER EXIST !!!!!!!!!!!!frank.

martiou07 · 25-01-2007, 21:42

hello Frank, I don't understand, the HD of Ossa Crying Wolf are not made??

Martial

martiou07 · 25-01-2007, 21:46

the radios can detect a problem of dysplasy but your dog can be it also if it is right a problem of angulation which will not exploit the health of your dog in its life but which will have to be isolated reproduction

Martial

wolfin · 25-01-2007, 22:41

Dear Furyos

i am interested in Ossa: why you breed female without HD examinations?

and what will be if your Ossa have HD D degree? then you know that your first litter is in danger to have the same degree and how could you see to owners eyes whn they will find out that their puppies mother has a strong HD degree and she was bred without examinations and it seems that you breed not healthy dogs purposely

Nebulosa · 26-01-2007, 00:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by furyos

[off topic]YOU never see cryingwolf dogs or visit hungria and yu speak just to speak ...this is what y dont like [off topic]

[off topic]
I not understand why you attack who talk about the displasy, I not know the crying wolfs and I never have affirme it, but I can see the HD-results who have in the site as you can too, I had one displasic dog, I can say that I will not buy one dog that have the 2 parents displasic as I never will say for the people buy one in the sdame conditions, I not want see again my dog who I love suffer even the end of his life with the displasy.
Call my attention this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Furyos

hi !!!.yes merlin is ok and all parent s ossa are hd B/B ..y wait the awsers about professor genevois(fci specialist) but my vetenary who take radio tell me he don t see bad things but it s not official yet ....BUT do yu know that 2 parents hd A/A can give C or D result ....it s not a guaranty it' just a precaution ...and 2 international dogs can give very bad looking dogs too ........y repeat a gain the PERFECTION NEVER EXIST !!!!!!!!!!!!frank.

Displasy is one problem not well know by it's genetic, the people know that it's recessive and poligenic, that's why it can appear in 2 HD: A dog litters, if they have the gen of the displasy, normally these dogs have A, but their have parents (far or not) with displasy ( B or C can be), is VERY rare one litter comes from 2 dogs with 5 or 6 generations HD: A have problems with displasy, and that's is comprove.
The official HD can be very different from one not official, only with the official HD you can know if your dog is Ok for be breeding or if will turn more one pet dog.
With all my " lack of age" I never have allowed 2 dogs without the official X ray make litter...

Greetings

Paula

furyos · 26-01-2007, 01:11

[off topic].wait few weeks and y have the official result and if it s A/A or B/B yu can present excuses for people who read yur romance(not for me y don' t care) and if y have bad results y explain my fault ....but y m sure about the result ....what race yu have before with displasy ? because y never see(or read) wolfdog(saarloos or clt )with hd D/D or E/E lames ....for molossoide dogs; yes it s a real problem of course and german sheperd too ...for wolfdog (new race )the problem is different ....but y wait result [off topic]

Nebulosa · 26-01-2007, 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by furyos

[off topic]wait few weeks and y have the official result and if it s A/A or B/B yu can present excuses for people who read yur romance(not for me y don' t care) and if y have bad results y explain my fault ....but y m sure about the result ....what race yu have before with displasy ? because y never see(or read) wolfdog(saarloos or clt )with hd D/D or E/E lames ....for molossoide dogs; yes it s a real problem of course and german sheperd too ...for wolfdog (new race )the problem is different ....but y wait result[off topic]

Only for you knowledge:
Alan z Smaragovych Vodopadu E(4/4)
Amazonka Eden severu E(4/3)
Akym Morusový háj E(4/4)
Ben z Litavské kotliny CS E(4/4)

That's cool that all these dogs fall in responsible hands who not have used then in the reproduction, and all are Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs, in Saarloos this problem appear too, we only not have a soo complet list as the WD.org DataBase for put the dogs and names here!
Is a shame one " breeder" who nor know the displasie cases of the breed that breeding!
So, sorry, but I will not lost my time with one " breeder" as you.

furyos · 26-01-2007, 01:42

yes it s true nebulosa don' t loose yur precious time ....with me and for information y m not breeder too .....my father was before and know more genetic and a lot of things but not all .....y can have freedom now??? ...........GREAT....THANK YU VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY MUTCH...y promise to became a good little boy and yu give me a nice picture and flowers for my mum .........YUR dear frank.(42 years and feel so young with yu ....better than botox or silicon)

michaelundinaeichhorn · 26-01-2007, 04:47

Just for your information: Orpheus Crying wolf which I happened to know when he was just a few month old and who is the full brother of your ossa was x-rayed then because he showed signes of light lamnes, he is HD D now, one of her other brothers got HD too. I know at least of two wolfdogs with HD that had to be treated before they were 1 year of age one of them has hip searchery with under a year now already. The interesting thing is not really the degree of the parents but the degree of the offspring of the parents, because it is polygenic it can be that the combination of two dogs can cause HD in the offspring. For example Colt Zepes was quite proplematic in this direction.

@ nebulosa: HDB is classified as normal hip within the genetic range in Germany. It shows a slightly divergence in the joint but a normal Norberg degree or a slightly lower Norberg degree with a close joint. It is of genetic interest but no HD, it is called suspicios for HD. In brees with small genetic range you can´t only use A dogs. But it is always difficult internationally seen because the judgement differs a bit in some countries. Koro Krotkovskeho dvora for example had a judgment of A in Slovakia but a C1 in Germany. But this is 8 years ago and as far as I can see Slowakia got much stricter. But in some countries you are allowed to x-ray your dog befor it is fully grown or to breed without any x-rays or the Norberg degree isn´t meassured so you can´t allways compare the results between countries.

Ina

wolfin · 26-01-2007, 09:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfin

Dear Furyos

i am interested in Ossa: why you breed female without HD examinations?

and what will be if your Ossa have HD D degree? then you know that your first litter is in danger to have the same degree and how could you see to owners eyes whn they will find out that their puppies mother has a strong HD degree and she was bred without examinations and it seems that you breed not healthy dogs purposely

hmmm i am WAITHING

furyos · 26-01-2007, 14:11

hi all ...in what language y can write to explain for all ...cryingwolf merlin is hdA /A !!!!!for bonitation we do' t have yet this system in france ...we have camp of jugment(n,ational breeders for name) with a lot of specialist of csw(juge etc;;

and merlin was 2e exellent .....that s all....bonitation is more in yuy countries where yur race are born ....yu don t have eiffel tower any more but yu can do a construction too after like "las vegas" (it ' s just a joke)wait ...little as little france do the same but we need time ....and in 1955 yu don t have bonitation too.....friendly frank!

Hanka · 26-01-2007, 14:28

In 1955 was very strict conditions for choosing dogs for next breeding. It was in czech army. Only wolfdogs with very stabil character and dogs good for work was dogs for breeding. Please read something about wolfdogs!!!!!
Wolfdogs are work breed, please respect it. The wolfdogs without bonitation (with strict tests of characters), without HD results- they are not WOLFDOGS for breeding. They are "wolfdogs", only.
They can have much titles from French (Dutch, belgian,....etc.) It is not important.

wolfin · 26-01-2007, 14:33

Dear Frank,

I'm still waiting for information about Ossa, exactly Ossa

and by the way, I'm not Mr., I'm Miss

furyos · 26-01-2007, 15:04

to hanka...where yu read mypostreply;where yu found negative or bad things about 1955 and tchek army ????...y know this hard selection don't worry(euthanasia for bad dogs.... etc) .....y just say in 1955 ;x ray hd don' t exist and show dog for this race too ...(it s not reconized for race ) y explain that little as little organisation (and technologie and science etc....)are more and more hight ....and in 1955 not because it s an "cynophily"experience for begining ....not? yur speak to speak and as yu can take one word (not in his sense)yu do a bad interpretation ...yu read 1955 /bonitation/xray and yu write of course furyos say bad things about selection ...in france we say it s" reductor attitude"...keep the time to read what y try to explain and after yu reply ...(in private please if yu have some doubts )because yur answer is difamatwar when yu write" read something about csw".Do yu live with me to see what y read? respect please. friendly frank.

Mirkawolf · 26-01-2007, 17:03

Dear Frank, Hanka had her first CSW at a time, when you did not even know yet that they existed. She is long-termed CSW owner and breeder from Czech republic and a member of the breeding commitee of the CSW Club in Czech republic. She has more experience with the breed than most of us here together. So please try to show some respect also to her.

Mirka

25-01-2007, 20:34	#25
wolfin Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Where the wolf lives Posts: 6,095	Furyos, sorry but i WOULD like information about Ossa. She do NOT have x-rays and have puppies. __________________

25-01-2007, 22:41	#29
wolfin Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Where the wolf lives Posts: 6,095	Dear Furyos i am interested in Ossa: why you breed female without HD examinations? and what will be if your Ossa have HD D degree? then you know that your first litter is in danger to have the same degree and how could you see to owners eyes whn they will find out that their puppies mother has a strong HD degree and she was bred without examinations and it seems that you breed not healthy dogs purposely __________________

26-01-2007, 01:11	#31
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	[off topic].wait few weeks and y have the official result and if it s A/A or B/B yu can present excuses for people who read yur romance(not for me y don' t care) and if y have bad results y explain my fault ....but y m sure about the result ....what race yu have before with displasy ? because y never see(or read) wolfdog(saarloos or clt )with hd D/D or E/E lames ....for molossoide dogs; yes it s a real problem of course and german sheperd too ...for wolfdog (new race )the problem is different ....but y wait result [off topic] Last edited by Nebulosa; 15-06-2008 at 17:05.

26-01-2007, 14:33	#38
wolfin Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Where the wolf lives Posts: 6,095	Dear Frank, I'm still waiting for information about Ossa, exactly Ossa and by the way, I'm not Mr., I'm Miss __________________

26-01-2007, 17:03	#40
Mirkawolf Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Brussels Posts: 556	Dear Frank, Hanka had her first CSW at a time, when you did not even know yet that they existed. She is long-termed CSW owner and breeder from Czech republic and a member of the breeding commitee of the CSW Club in Czech republic. She has more experience with the breed than most of us here together. So please try to show some respect also to her. Mirka __________________ :: :: :: Cira & Ali & Tulip :: :: :: http://vlcisen.mirkawolf.com

25-01-2007, 14:08	#21
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	hi wolfin y have little problem with my pc now y try to write yu tonight...frank

25-01-2007, 20:10	#23
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	hi again ...y hope my mail go now because y have little pb today ....well ...if y understand yur awnser and yur question yu want to know my opinion for breeding ?of course wolfdogs are not christmass tree and decoration is not the most important (but it ' s yu that yu write 35 shows)....y just explain why y try and do now show.....when y go to hungria to visit edit's kennel y fall really in love about cryingwolf merlin....(y know that it s so subjectiv)and when y ask about edit y want to bye him she say straightly and definitly NO!!!!!!!!!!!!(merlin is adult and she keep him for her)but like a kid y stay a long time in the hungria snow with basket shoos(yu can imagine the situation) and y do a promise...:to export the quality of merlin to france and his of course do show...../............(next in few minutes)

25-01-2007, 20:28	#24
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	and edit say ok ...little as little he win some show and have good comment but the truth y don't(and he don't) like so much show...but promise is promise!!!.....do yu know a lot of dogs( if we can talk with them ) prefered show than stay at home quiet or go to walk in hood with masters ....this is for show my opinion ....for work f course y know that wolfdog are created for work (and it's in the standard)but it s the same if we have all human and dogs the CHOICE ....what we prefered ?vavations of course !!!!!!!!!!and FREEDOM like wolf or other savage animals ...this for work but y understand dogs work but y think it s so good too when people keep their dogs in family life too...before all dogs are selected for work(ex of caniche is typical) and little as little they love them like kids or best friends and it s so normal attitude...nobody can change that ...BUT the DANGER is people do confusion between dogs and things ...and put them in REFUGE ....that is criminal and not responsible attitude!!!!!!!!!!!!!!this is my opinion for work ....well y hope yu understand me and convictions too ....friendly ...frank

25-01-2007, 21:29	#26
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	hi !!!.yes merlin is ok and all parent s ossa are hd B/B ..y wait the awsers about professor genevois(fci specialist) but my vetenary who take radio tell me he don t see bad things but it s not official yet ....BUT do yu know that 2 parents hd A/A can give C or D result ....it s not a guaranty it' just a precaution ...and 2 international dogs can give very bad looking dogs too ........y repeat a gain the PERFECTION NEVER EXIST !!!!!!!!!!!!frank.

25-01-2007, 21:42	#27
martiou07 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: France Posts: 1,986	hello Frank, I don't understand, the HD of Ossa Crying Wolf are not made?? Martial

25-01-2007, 21:46	#28
martiou07 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: France Posts: 1,986	the radios can detect a problem of dysplasy but your dog can be it also if it is right a problem of angulation which will not exploit the health of your dog in its life but which will have to be isolated reproduction Martial

26-01-2007, 01:42	#33
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	yes it s true nebulosa don' t loose yur precious time ....with me and for information y m not breeder too .....my father was before and know more genetic and a lot of things but not all .....y can have freedom now??? ...........GREAT....THANK YU VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY MUTCH...y promise to became a good little boy and yu give me a nice picture and flowers for my mum .........YUR dear frank.(42 years and feel so young with yu ....better than botox or silicon)

26-01-2007, 04:47	#34
michaelundinaeichhorn Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Bad Dürkheim Posts: 2,249	Just for your information: Orpheus Crying wolf which I happened to know when he was just a few month old and who is the full brother of your ossa was x-rayed then because he showed signes of light lamnes, he is HD D now, one of her other brothers got HD too. I know at least of two wolfdogs with HD that had to be treated before they were 1 year of age one of them has hip searchery with under a year now already. The interesting thing is not really the degree of the parents but the degree of the offspring of the parents, because it is polygenic it can be that the combination of two dogs can cause HD in the offspring. For example Colt Zepes was quite proplematic in this direction. @ nebulosa: HDB is classified as normal hip within the genetic range in Germany. It shows a slightly divergence in the joint but a normal Norberg degree or a slightly lower Norberg degree with a close joint. It is of genetic interest but no HD, it is called suspicios for HD. In brees with small genetic range you can´t only use A dogs. But it is always difficult internationally seen because the judgement differs a bit in some countries. Koro Krotkovskeho dvora for example had a judgment of A in Slovakia but a C1 in Germany. But this is 8 years ago and as far as I can see Slowakia got much stricter. But in some countries you are allowed to x-ray your dog befor it is fully grown or to breed without any x-rays or the Norberg degree isn´t meassured so you can´t allways compare the results between countries. Ina

26-01-2007, 14:11	#36
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	hi all ...in what language y can write to explain for all ...cryingwolf merlin is hdA /A !!!!!for bonitation we do' t have yet this system in france ...we have camp of jugment(n,ational breeders for name) with a lot of specialist of csw(juge etc;; and merlin was 2e exellent .....that s all....bonitation is more in yuy countries where yur race are born ....yu don t have eiffel tower any more but yu can do a construction too after like "las vegas" (it ' s just a joke)wait ...little as little france do the same but we need time ....and in 1955 yu don t have bonitation too.....friendly frank!

26-01-2007, 14:28	#37
Hanka Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Kadaň Posts: 1,622	In 1955 was very strict conditions for choosing dogs for next breeding. It was in czech army. Only wolfdogs with very stabil character and dogs good for work was dogs for breeding. Please read something about wolfdogs!!!!! Wolfdogs are work breed, please respect it. The wolfdogs without bonitation (with strict tests of characters), without HD results- they are not WOLFDOGS for breeding. They are "wolfdogs", only. They can have much titles from French (Dutch, belgian,....etc.) It is not important.

26-01-2007, 15:04	#39
furyos Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 729	to hanka...where yu read mypostreply;where yu found negative or bad things about 1955 and tchek army ????...y know this hard selection don't worry(euthanasia for bad dogs.... etc) .....y just say in 1955 ;x ray hd don' t exist and show dog for this race too ...(it s not reconized for race ) y explain that little as little organisation (and technologie and science etc....)are more and more hight ....and in 1955 not because it s an "cynophily"experience for begining ....not? yur speak to speak and as yu can take one word (not in his sense)yu do a bad interpretation ...yu read 1955 /bonitation/xray and yu write of course furyos say bad things about selection ...in france we say it s" reductor attitude"...keep the time to read what y try to explain and after yu reply ...(in private please if yu have some doubts )because yur answer is difamatwar when yu write" read something about csw".Do yu live with me to see what y read? respect please. friendly frank.

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