Ugly feminine males...

[buidelwolf]

Typical or untypical, masculin or feminin, for me Bux is my favorite type of wolfdog!

[canislupus]

....absolut beautiful...

I would take him immediately as studdog!!!

Tanja

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by canislupus

I would take him immediately as studdog!!!

Tanja

But not for Caya, since he is more or less genetically identical with her grandfather Koro. And he's dead anyway.

Michael

[Monika]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

But not for Caya, since he is more or less genetically identical with her grandfather Koro. And he's dead anyway.

Michael

Standard say too .. General appearance:
Firm type in constitution, more than a medium-sized, rectangular frame.
For me is very funny and sad at the same time that anybody tries to teach the one of creatos of the breed Mr. Hartl
how make correct judgemet and what is important.
Many people here have a problem with the determination of a constitutional type of dog.
Bux was dry constitutional type R1 - and this is considered acceptable - but not desirable extreme!
Constitutional type is not an end in itself! It combines not only the exterior, but also the psychological characteristics of a dog. Wolves live 16 to 18 years in captivity ... if " you " are think that: if the dog will live 8 years and all is OK, I have another view.
Bux is died. How many years?
Adon Irpruš is allive, still he is 15 years old!

Each can breed "type" what he likes. I not have problem accept other opinion I am no fanatic..(I am a Witch I know) but Standard is clear and the creators knew what they are doing.
In standard minimum height exist but no maximum...
Young Wolf shot died about 2 to 3 years old, December 2009 on the Slovak weighed 46 kg.
photo si here: http://zmolu.csvlcak.cz/displayimage...p&cat=-9&pos=0
Weight euroasian wolves (depending on the age ranges between 40 to 80 kg!)
Do not attempt here to create the illusion that the wolves have weak constitution!

Witch Soukupová

[canislupus]

I know he´s dead...

anyway, it´s a pity!!!

Tanja

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by z Peronówki

It depend on "what is a CzW MALE for you". What is a STANDARD - "0" pooint on the scala.
If it is a male dog described int he standard as TYPICAL or a male which has heavy untypical head with wrinkles, hanging lips and eyelids and wrong proportions of the head.

YES, I agree with you that compared to some CzW males Bux is lookong like a female.
NO, "VERY MASCULINE" males are for sure not untypical representants for this breed. For me BUX is a nice Wolfdog, the heavy "VERY MASCULINE" males are just untypical. If you do not believe - compare theit look with the breed standard...

i dont run this male down, i give only my oppinion, but you have to admit lots of male dogs now being produced in southern parts of Europe and getting produced for glamour rather than working, and they are getting smaller in size with soft coats the males also becoming fine of bone, some strugling to make 58cm in hight, i have looked at hundreds of photos of CWS on this web site and private sites and there is a definate change comming about and there are lots of size differences in many dogs, they also have great difference in coats, i have seen this happen with lots of breeds over the last 35 yrs, i keep what i call extream photos of the CWS that difffer from the normal ones. they appear everywhere???/ i have read the breed standard, and i have attened many European shows and seen CWS with there tails so far between there legs and looking petrified, yet still winning honours, also i wonder why the change in standard regarding some missing teeth came about ha ha///

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Monika dearest victim,

Adon Iprus didn´t have to live at Krotkovsky´s place and you steadily have problems to remember Major Rosik.
I know of offspring of Adon Iprus that didn´t reach age or quality of health of wolves, not to mention the exterieur problems (to prevent witch-gossip, Dak z Rosikova is said to have died of a turned stomach) and not so ideal HD-results. A very good example that to watch only the dog itself doesn´t say anything about it´s breeding quality. And again this is what breeding is about.
But I only took him for an example because you obviously judged him the excellent male on this exhibition, I didn´t want to discredit him, he simply is very unsimilar to an European wolf.

As it was mentioned several times do we discuss a breed of dog not wolves. But the standart clearly states that the ideal is a dog similar to an European wolf not a German Shepherd.
And there is an enormous range between much too heavy build dogs and a weak constitution, I can´t see any weak constitution in Bux and do work with European wolves (that normally don´t reach 80 kg if they are not fat) every day and as a vet can see the results of too heavy or too weak constitutions much too often. I see an athletic, elegant dog that surely had an excellent movement.

Ina

P.S. you shouldnt forget the word black in front of your new name!

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by solowolf

i dont run this male down, i give only my oppinion, but you have to admit lots of male dogs now being produced in southern parts of Europe and getting produced for glamour rather than working, and they are getting smaller in size with soft coats the males also becoming fine of bone, some strugling to make 58cm in hight, i have looked at hundreds of photos of CWS on this web site and private sites and there is a definate change comming about and there are lots of size differences in many dogs, they also have great difference in coats, i have seen this happen with lots of breeds over the last 35 yrs, i keep what i call extream photos of the CWS that difffer from the normal ones. they appear everywhere???/ i have read the breed standard, and i have attened many European shows and seen CWS with there tails so far between there legs and looking petrified, yet still winning honours, also i wonder why the change in standard regarding some missing teeth came about ha ha///

As you can see on this homepage was Bux born 1994 in a Slovakian kennel and had a hight of 69 cm. None of the bonitated offspring was under the official height.

Ina

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

As you can see on this homepage was Bux born 1994 in a Slovakian kennel and had a hight of 69 cm. None of the bonitated offspring was under the official height.

Ina

who mentioned anything about this dogs hieght ???

[Monika]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

Monika dearest victim,

Adon Iprus didn´t have to live at Krotkovsky´s place and you steadily have problems to remember Major Rosik.
I know of offspring of Adon Iprus that didn´t reach age or quality of health of wolves, not to mention the exterieur problems (to prevent witch-gossip, Dak z Rosikova is said to have died of a turned stomach) and not so ideal HD-results. A very good example that to watch only the dog itself doesn´t say anything about it´s breeding quality. And again this is what breeding is about.
But I only took him for an example because you obviously judged him the excellent male on this exhibition, I didn´t want to discredit him, he simply is very unsimilar to an European wolf.

As it was mentioned several times do we discuss a breed of dog not wolves. But the standart clearly states that the ideal is a dog similar to an European wolf not a German Shepherd.
And there is an enormous range between much too heavy build dogs and a weak constitution, I can´t see any weak constitution in Bux and do work with European wolves (that normally don´t reach 80 kg if they are not fat) every day and as a vet can see the results of too heavy or too weak constitutions much too often. I see an athletic, elegant dog that surely had an excellent movement.

Ina

P.S. you shouldnt forget the word black in front of your new name!

Absolutely always you pick from the text what's convenient.
There's not even talking about rough dogs or lymphatic type.
And certainly not about animals who are overweight! I'm talking about the weight of wolves in the wild than in the Zoo and the like.
And the Constitution is still something other than the Condition and you should know, sorry!:
The CSW is desirable solid - firm constitutional type!
Not rough or dry.
Exclusionary type is fine and lymphatic!

I think, was from Margo very stupid and sad to pull photos already dead dog and try to discuss over them.

I had never been judged him but I knew and saw him personaly.
He was judged others Šimáčková, Hartl, Jančík, Dora, Rosík Jr. ...


I am witch, for you surely...and I will stay witch, no problem.

Monika Soukupová

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

This is the dog this thread is about.

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by Monika

Absolutely always you pick from the text what's convenient.
There's not even talking about rough dogs or lymphatic type.
And certainly not about animals who are overweight! I'm talking about the weight of wolves in the wild than in the Zoo and the like.
And the Constitution is still something other than the Condition and you should know, sorry!:
The CSW is desirable solid - firm constitutional type!
Not rough or dry.
Exclusionary type is fine and lymphatic!

I think, was from Margo very stupid and sad to pull photos already dead dog and try to discuss over them.

I had never been judged him but I knew and saw him personaly.
He was judged others Šimáčková, Hartl, Jančík, Dora, Rosík Jr. ...


I am witch, for you surely...and I will stay witch, no problem.

Monika Soukupová

hi i would like to appologise for any comments i made regarding this dog, to both the breeder and the past owner, I had no idea this wolfdog was dead, very sorry Ronnie Winder u.k.

[z Peronówki]

Next 'professional' and 'nice' comment from a FCI judge M. Soukupova....

Originally Posted by Monika

I think, was from Margo very stupid and sad to pull photos already dead dog and try to discuss over them.

Do you mean it SERIOUS???? So from now it is forbidden to speak about ANY ancestors of our dogs because you say so.... Because ALL OF THEM A DEAD? Are you joking?

[Monika]

Originally Posted by z Peronówki

Next 'professional' and 'nice' comment from a FCI judge M. Soukupova....



Do you mean it SERIOUS???? So from now it is forbidden to speak about ANY ancestors of our dogs because you say so.... Because ALL OF THEM A DEAD? Are you joking?

Forbidden??? Me like " Witch " can prohibit something HERE??? You can " freeze " Me when you want. Good joke!

" We " can write and speak what we want, of course, is democracy - but if the animal is dead, we will be just speculation, always.
And judgement from pictures? I do not.
Everyone remembers the dog a little different, for me is authoritative
judgemet of Mr. Hartl and what he said, I remember it well.
So how he did it and you called this forum but it not was truth! I never heard that someone said about Bux " untypical " only you in an effort to dramatize problem, what not exist at all.

You are just bored

Witch Soukupová

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by Monika

Absolutely always you pick from the text what's convenient.
There's not even talking about rough dogs or lymphatic type.
And certainly not about animals who are overweight! I'm talking about the weight of wolves in the wild than in the Zoo and the like.
And the Constitution is still something other than the Condition and you should know, sorry!:
The CSW is desirable solid - firm constitutional type!
Not rough or dry.
Exclusionary type is fine and lymphatic!

I think, was from Margo very stupid and sad to pull photos already dead dog and try to discuss over them.

I had never been judged him but I knew and saw him personaly.
He was judged others Šimáčková, Hartl, Jančík, Dora, Rosík Jr. ...


I am witch, for you surely...and I will stay witch, no problem.

Monika Soukupová

Originally Posted by Monika

S
Weight euroasian wolves (depending on the age ranges between 40 to 80 kg!)
Do not attempt here to create the illusion that the wolves have weak constitution!

Witch Soukupová

http://www.wolfsregion-lausitz.de/bi...weise/portrait
I apologize, I really should have known better than to take anything you wrote seriously, at least I learned to avoid questions.

Ina

[Monika]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

http://www.wolfsregion-lausitz.de/bi...weise/portrait
I apologize, I really should have known better than to take anything you wrote seriously, at least I learned to avoid questions.

Ina

Your comment was unnecessary. I talked about wolves gunned down in recent years.
80 kg is the largest wolf that I found the information. Your studies (and exist many!) Provides 30 - 50kg.. Other more - 39 to 72 kg.....
... 20 to 80 kg.
It depends on the age, health, maintenance condition, surely.

[elf]

What's important in such case is not the boundaries but the mean and standard deviation of the distribution weight curve shape, if you have those informations I would be eager to learn it... especially for CSV, thanks.

[Denial]

This doesn't mean that humas go from 50 cm to 230 cm, as like 90% of male population goes from 170 to 190 cmq, and almost the same thing is for weight as obesity is not a big problem in nature.
But this topic is much about whining then numbers.

[Silvester]

Hey Denial,

this is really a great picture !!!
By the way: Do you know these two people on the photo personally?

May be YOU made the photo ??

( I guess the woman is the "type" of long legged and slim like most people here prefer for the dogs....just like Bux. But she´s a little extreme...)

Ok, one can also see that this woman is a very feminine type...only because of long legs of course...!

Best regards from Germany

[Monika]

Originally Posted by elf

What's important in such case is not the boundaries but the mean and standard deviation of the distribution weight curve shape, if you have those informations I would be eager to learn it... especially for CSV, thanks.

University of Agriculture in Prague and her students worked as a bachelor and engineering several topics related to CSWs. Concern the processing of metric´ s data and the heredity of character of CSWs.
University scientists received also a grant for research and compare DNA CSW, SAW and Wolves.
None of the work does not cater for the mass - weight of animals :0(
In any action relating to the CSWs does not record the weight,
there is nothing to process. Maybe it's a good type.
In my experience the weight of females ranges from 25 to 33 kg. Constitutionally weak females are about 23 kg. In males,
the weight ranges from 32 to 40 kg.
We are talking about healthy animals in "show condition."

One of the hardest CSW, which I knew was Freeking, but he was late in life much fat - weighed 60 kg.
If he was fit he had 46 -50 kilograms he lived 13 years.

Witch Soukupová, still