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Old 01-01-2011, 01:31   #1
Gypsy Wolf
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Default Anyone have experience with a purebred wolf?

Hi all,
Just wondering if anyone on this board has any experience raising and living with a purebred wolf? There is a breeder in TX http://www.freewebs.com/wolfhavenspiritofthepast/ who breeds pure wolves for companions.
As an Ethologist, I have always wanted to have a wolf or coyote as a companion - to see the "raw" canine nature - to study them in my own environment.
The above breeder has several different strains that she breeds, all of them with different temperament characteristics. Of them, I am inclined towards the McKenzie Valley strain. I am not so interested in a hybrid, nor am I interested in breeding (I would spay/neuter at maturity) - I just want to experience living with a real wolf...
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Old 01-01-2011, 02:24   #2
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Hey there,
I almost never post here but when I saw this post and I had to sign in to write a reply! Please stay FAR, FAR away from this breeder! They are very well known all through the ("american") wolfdog world as being some of the worst for misrepresentation and flat out lies. They certainly do not breed pure wolves, from the very few rather blurry pictures they put up of their dogs it's painfully obvious that they are low contents or dogs, most of all them. Here you can see them http://www.freewebs.com/wolfhavenspi...hourwolves.htm they are definitely a mix of malamute/husky/GSD and who knows what else but certainly very little if any wolf.
They also have some very unlikely claims...here are some quotes.
"The wolf is the lion of the North. They are called that because they are descendants from the same lineage as lions.
Their eyes are that of a lion brown color and a thick mane runs around their neck and down their back. Females have shorter hair than males.
They also have a cat-like bone structure. They can collapse and dislocate their joints.

They can "collapse and dislocate their joints"??? And from the same lineage as lions....I have no idea where these ideas are coming from but I see no common sense. Anyway I would please advise to stay away from these breeders. If you actually want a pure wolf (and please, think it through carefully...all the facts on that website are completely fabricated) please find another more responsible breeder.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunas Mom View Post
Hi all,
Just wondering if anyone on this board has any experience raising and living with a purebred wolf? There is a breeder in TX http://www.freewebs.com/wolfhavenspiritofthepast/ who breeds pure wolves for companions.
As an Ethologist, I have always wanted to have a wolf or coyote as a companion - to see the "raw" canine nature - to study them in my own environment.
The above breeder has several different strains that she breeds, all of them with different temperament characteristics. Of them, I am inclined towards the McKenzie Valley strain. I am not so interested in a hybrid, nor am I interested in breeding (I would spay/neuter at maturity) - I just want to experience living with a real wolf...
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Old 01-01-2011, 02:37   #3
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Thank you so much for your reply. My only link to the american wolfdog community is through this more international site - I have a vlcak...
I do agree some of the claims are a little much...!!!
I am having a difficult time finding pure wolf breeders to even converse with let alone purchase a pup from - would love any guidance you could give me.
And yes, I have been thinking long and hard - for many years - probably since I first got involved in Animal Behavior studies in college and studied the various wild canines (my 1993 BA major was Animal Behavior), about bringing a pure wolf into my life.
I am in no rush - it would likely be a few years at least before I brought a wolf pup into my home, but I would like to find a responsible pure wolf breeder I could develop a mentor-type relationship with who I would eventually purchase a pup from. I am in no way interested in breeding wolves myself, so unless keeping the animal intact was required by the breeder, he (I would prefer a male) would be neutered at maturity.
I am on Disability and only work part-time, so I do have the time to devote to the intense relationship requirements - and I have perhaps a different understanding of them than the average joe...
Again, thank you and if you have some contacts or guidance for me, I would greatly appreciate it.
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Old 01-01-2011, 04:08   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunas Mom View Post
I just want to experience living with a real wolf...
Than go do it in the wild, where they behave natural

And if you really love wolves do not get one for your own good

Best regards / Mikael
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Old 01-01-2011, 09:24   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
Than go do it in the wild, where they behave natural

And if you really love wolves do not get one for your own good

Best regards / Mikael
!!!
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Old 01-01-2011, 10:11   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
And if you really love wolves do not get one for your own good

Best regards / Mikael
This is just what I also wanted to write.
I am not sure about USA, but in most of countries in Europe it is illegal to keep a wild creature at home.
This summer one family contacted me to ask what to do with a little sparrow, who was found out of it's nest - I contacted the ornitologist's organization, so they told that in fact they even had no right to take the sparrow home!

And people so easily take wild animals as wolves and make them their pets - this is not "love for wolves" this is "look how cool I am", nothing more.

I know this - I have similar feelings about ravens, a girl I know owns one, she found it injured. Amazingly interesting bird, very very intelectual (as much as I've read, more than even the big parrots), so I keep dreaming about also having one. But I am not afraid to admit it is an ego thing - it is interesting and fun for ME, also - haha - this looks cool, doesn't it? A lady with a "wolf" and a real raven Still this is not a reason to start looking for a raven...
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Last edited by Vaiva; 01-01-2011 at 10:20.
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Old 01-01-2011, 10:26   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
Than go do it in the wild, where they behave natural

And if you really love wolves do not get one for your own good

Best regards / Mikael
I totally agree and I have experience with living with several adult wolves.

For me private keeping of a wolf like you plan to do it is pure egoism and abuse of an animal.
Even if you would have the money and space to keep him in an appropriate enclosure, is thinking of keeping one and thinking to be able to compensate the companionship of another wolf for him abusive and naive, even your wolfdogs can´t compensate.

Sorry for those rude words but if you have been involved in behaviour studies worth this name you should know better.


But don´t worry, you will get more than enough PMs of at least one member here..

Ina
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Old 01-01-2011, 10:28   #8
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Default Just a fake !

Hello and best wishes for new year 2011 to everyone here first of all !

As "Kootenay" has told here before it´s obvious that this "breeder" has not wolves but definitely dog- mixes, may be with more or less wolf-blood...

You can see on the different photos without any doubt that these animals are no pure wolves.

And at last i agree to the opinion of all the other posters here before:

It is complete nonsense trying to keep a wolf as a pet !

I´m wondering about that this is need to be told !

Best greetings ,

Uli alias Silvester from Germany
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Old 01-01-2011, 11:15   #9
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It is complete nonsense trying to keep a wolf as a pet !
Agree 100%!!!

Lunas Mom, you've probably realized that there is a lot of controversy going on here, people argue, disagree, confront each other, have conflicting interests, etc.

But when MOST forum members, who normally have very different opinions agree on something it's very meaningful. Please, take this aspect under very careful consideration.
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Old 01-01-2011, 11:34   #10
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' Responsible' breeders of pure wolves would work to preserve the numbers in the wild, not make them for pet or even experimental private keeping.

I agree with Ina and for the life of me, can't understand who would look at that site (I've seen them before) and not just laugh.. I truly think that those people have mental problems.

Besides, even if they were the real thing, I would never condone the keeping of some critically endangered animals like the Mexican wolf as a personal pet project...

Last edited by yukidomari; 01-01-2011 at 11:44.
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Old 01-01-2011, 13:04   #11
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Hi,

since you called yourself an "ethologist" several times you better should donate your energy and money in projects like this

/www.defenders.org/

rather than taking even in consideration buying a wolf from people like this so called breeder.
By the way, as an ethologist you should know that you cannot breed not domesticated animals like wolves and other species.
"Breeding" is a sign of domestication.
Sorry for my open words, but I'm fed up with people like for example another "famous" user here, telling that you can keep wolves or wolf hybrids as pets.

Michael
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Old 01-01-2011, 15:57   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunas Mom View Post
Thank you so much for your reply. My only link to the american wolfdog community is through this more international site - I have a vlcak...
I do agree some of the claims are a little much...!!!
I am having a difficult time finding pure wolf breeders to even converse with let alone purchase a pup from - would love any guidance you could give me.
And yes, I have been thinking long and hard - for many years - probably since I first got involved in Animal Behavior studies in college and studied the various wild canines (my 1993 BA major was Animal Behavior), about bringing a pure wolf into my life.
I am in no rush - it would likely be a few years at least before I brought a wolf pup into my home, but [B]I would like to find a responsible pure wolf breeder [/b]I could develop a mentor-type relationship with who I would eventually purchase a pup from. I am in no way interested in breeding wolves myself, so unless keeping the animal intact was required by the breeder, he (I would prefer a male) would be neutered at maturity.
I am on Disability and only work part-time, so I do have the time to devote to the intense relationship requirements - and I have perhaps a different understanding of them than the average joe...
Again, thank you and if you have some contacts or guidance for me, I would greatly appreciate it.
is there such a thing

if ,as you say,you had more of an understanding of them ,why on earth would you want one as a pet?

also,without meaning to offend you in anyway... you also advocate pinch collars etc whilst training your dogs? what tool would you decide to use to 'control' your 'pet wolf'?
of course a lot of people dream of living with a wolf...and imo it should stay just that, a dream...enjoy your csv and learn from them :-)

happy new year all :-)
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Old 01-01-2011, 17:52   #13
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If I had enough money, I would rather buy land where wild wolves could live their own life undisturbed by the activity of people. As that is not likely to come to pass, I buy trees instead. There is this organisation in Slovakia, which is buying land in Eastern Slovakia in Cergov mountains and which has build a private reservation there. By buying a tree, you help buy more land, where the wood is not cut and where animals can live freely and not hunted. Wolves live there too, so although I don't own a wolf, I own a piece of land where it can live its life. I would recommend everybody to find a similar organisation in his/her own country - or any other country and donate some money or efforts in this kind of direction. It is much better for the wolves than trying to own one.
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Old 01-01-2011, 19:25   #14
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Originally Posted by saschia View Post
If I had enough money, I would rather buy land where wild wolves could live their own life undisturbed by the activity of people. As that is not likely to come to pass, I buy trees instead. There is this organisation in Slovakia, which is buying land in Eastern Slovakia in Cergov mountains and which has build a private reservation there. By buying a tree, you help buy more land, where the wood is not cut and where animals can live freely and not hunted. Wolves live there too, so although I don't own a wolf, I own a piece of land where it can live its life. I would recommend everybody to find a similar organisation in his/her own country - or any other country and donate some money or efforts in this kind of direction. It is much better for the wolves than trying to own one.
Excellent ide

Very best regards / Mikael
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Old 02-01-2011, 15:35   #15
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Happy New Year to you all!!!

Family Eichhorn, thank you very much, that you always think at me. I must made a big impression in your life, that you can not live without me. Reading by the way two threads and in both two, between the lines I am mentioned. Thanks for keeping me alive, hahaha!

Luna´s Mom, please do not be angry, but it seems indeed that you do not know a lot about wolves... Otherwise you would have seen immediately that the breeder you did link is a dreamer. These animals are dogs, maybe low contents but never ever pure wolves. Please read these two links (in the first link, Jimmy put another link to his own experiences) and think about if you could manage these experiences. And of course never have a wolf alone, he or she always needs a partner!

About winter wolf syndrom/seasonale aggression

http://www.wolfdogforum.com/forum/vi...&t=101&start=0

and aboout the same theme please scroll down to 6th of july 2008, but 7th of nov 2008 is interesting too.

http://awolfadventure.blogspot.com/


Don´t you live in Florida, when I do remember right, Luna´s mom? You are allowed to have wolfdogs F 1 75 % max.

Here are the laws in for the USA: http://www.hybridlaw.com/

Have a nice year

Christian
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Old 02-01-2011, 20:48   #16
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I have studied them in the wild - Brrrr! Very cold environments. Don't worry, this is NOT, I repeat, NOT something I am planning to do in the near future, nor would I collect a wolf into my environment without properly preparing for the best, most enriched, life able to be provided.
Actually, I would much prefer a coyote to study (I have done that in the wild, too), all things considered.
My desire to keep, interact with and study a real wolf in a captive environment is to try to see how and where the wild behaviors were either suppressed or exploited due to human intervention. I am not interested in keeping an animal for my own personal pleasure, but more for personal study - the desire to see what the "base" animal of our domesticated dog is really like - that's why I am NOT interested in any hybrid. I want to see the intelligence, reasoning capabilty, natural aptitudes really are in our dogs' ancestor.
THis is not something I would take on lightly - and at this stage of my life, I do not have to room to be able to take on a wolf properly (my interest in this subject has been a part of my life since I studied them in the wild in 1992).
I am glad my comments brought about such discussion - my first step will likely be to volunteer at a wolf refuge at some point, before I decide to actually take on one for myself.
Where I live now, we recently found coyotes have extended their southern range to Coral Springs, FL - so I am actually considering finding the den and studying them here in their new natural environment - suburban/urban communities. The city of Chicago even employs them as ratters in the downtown area, and as I said before, I am more attracted to them as a species of interest as they are so incredibly intelligent and adaptable....
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Old 02-01-2011, 21:43   #17
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A coyote is not a wolf!!!!

A wolf in capitivity is not a wolf in the wild!!!

A "hybrid" is not so much different to a wolf or what do you think is a F 1 90 %? It is always a matter of genes. I know F 2 which are like dogs and I know F 4 who are like wolf. So laws are funny because they have nothing in common with genes. Modern scientific did not make their "pawz" in actual laws. So they are werth nothing!

Have fun.

Christian
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Old 02-01-2011, 22:59   #18
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Lunas Mom, but today's wolves are not ancestors of dogs. They evolved from the same ancestors, under the influence of their respective habitats, which included men, for the wolves usually as competitors or even as hunters. And todays populations of wolves are mostly small scraps that remained after centuries-long pressure of men trying to completely abolish them. Last couple of centuries, the selection on wolves was very hard, especially on their behavior.
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Old 02-01-2011, 23:12   #19
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What are you talking about Saschia? In italy for example are about 1.000 wolves and about 1.000.000 wild living dogs. Some of the wolves mixe together with some dogs and these hybrids live in the villages and with people! And some of them recrosses with wolves again. That is one reason why in italy live about 250 black wolves. You know this research from 2008 that the black color in wolves come from dogs?

In spain is the same, in greece, slovenia and bulgary.

That is nature!!!!
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Old 03-01-2011, 00:04   #20
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And? Do you want to say that those wolves are the same as there were before dogs were domesticated?

The black color in wolves is from dogs - also in North Americas. The change is very old and probably origined independently a couple of times. So you actually cannot say that it did not originate in wolves too, but that was not the meaning of my previous post. The meaning was that you will never get to know the behavior of dog's ancestor from the behavior of recent, captured wolves. Not that is not a valid interest, but my opinion is, if someone wants to study wolves or coyotes in capture, one should be a part of a project, and not torment one wolf (or even a couple) by conditions a single human being is able to provide. There are too many wolves living in enclosures to add to that number.
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