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Old 28-01-2005, 00:10   #1
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Default Norway to kill 25% of its wolves

The Norwegian government has decided to kill five of the country's grey wolves - a quarter of the entire population.

It says the decision is necessary to protect domestic livestock, but one campaign group has condemned the cull.

WWF-Norway says two wolves have been shot already, one of them from a pack which has not been targeted and which it fears may now not manage to survive.

Wolves are protected in Norway, and are listed as critically endangered, and WWF says many people oppose the cull.

The decision to kill five animals out of the 20 remaining in Norway was taken by the nature directorate, which advises the government. WWF-Norway is calling for an immediate halt to the hunt.

Survival 'at risk'

Its head, Rasmus Hansson, said: "If the Norwegian environment minister does not stop this hunt, he will have the dubious honour of allowing the regular hunting of a nationally endangered species.

Two grey wolves WWF-Canon/Chris Martin Bahr
Breeding may be at risk (Image: WWF-Canon/Chris Martin Bahr)
"The culling of 20-30% of a population this size is a serious threat to the survival of this species in Norway.

"This practice is contrary to internationally accepted standards for wildlife management. No other country that I know of has such an aggressive policy towards its wolves."

The Norwegian parliament decided last May the country should sustain at least three family packs of wolves.

Packs can range in size from two adults to 10 or more animals covering several generations. WWF says the current hunt will reduce the number of packs to two at most.

Mr Hansson told the BBC: "One wolf from the pack to be culled was shot on 15 January, and another female from a different pack on 21 January.

"We don't know the exact size of the targeted pack, because we don't know whether it produced any cubs last summer. If it did, they will be left orphaned.

Steady decline

"Now, in all likelihood, by killing the wrong animal they've ruined another pack. The animal was an alpha female, so breeding may be affected and the pack could dissolve."

Grey wolf in snow WWF-Canon/Roger LeGuen
Norway's wolves are now very rare (Image: WWF-Canon/Roger LeGuen)
WWF says there were an estimated 50-80 wolves in the southern part of Norway and Sweden in 2001, consisting of several families.

That year Norway approved the culling of eight out of its 25 wolves, leaving 20 today, because the target was not met.

A recent study of the wider Scandinavian wolf population concluded there were 120 at the most.

Mr Hansson said: "There is a serious risk of genetic degradation in this population because of its small size. A genetically healthy population... should have at least 800 individuals."

He told the BBC: "The cull is meant to protect sheep. Sheep farming occupies 90% of Norway's territory.

"We have 250-300,000 moose and 30,000 reindeer. In that perspective 800 wolves shouldn't be too many, though we've never suggested it - it's just a biological fact."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4194963.stm
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Old 28-01-2005, 03:12   #2
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I don't particularly care that they are wolves, doing this to any animal is criminal.

Scandinavian Wolves... aren't they a particular breed of wolf? The images of them I have found are very spectacular and definately rare... It's late and I don't know what to do about this right now, (I thought about writing to the EU parliament but then I remembered that Norway is not a member) Might do that anyhow, too late right now and I need to think.

Some would say they howl in rage... I'm too tired for that right now just angry and frustrated that some fellow humans can be so near sighted.

Cheers... maybe if we all think together on this there might be something which we can do. I don't fancy sitting on my backside and watching it happen.
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Old 29-01-2005, 00:04   #3
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Norvegian Dickheads...more funny shoot to a wolf that buy a Maremman Sheperd.
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Old 29-01-2005, 00:49   #4
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Does anybody have any idea if / how we could help?
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Old 31-01-2005, 00:32   #5
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As promised I looked into this problem a little.

It seems like Norwegians do not have a very good track record with wolves, this is not the first time they have done a similar cull, even though there are very few wolves in Norway, and this is without taking into account the effects of poaching (estimated to have killed 120 wolves in Scandinavia in the last 20 years… if you consider that the “stable” population size is around 100 animals that is enormous)

Here a couple of other articles for those who can stomach this sort of thing:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...icle958181.ece
http://www.wpherald.com/storyview.ph...6-034037-6898r

This is a very interesting background paper to the whole wolf situation in Norway

http://www.wolfsociety.org.uk/educat.../no-4-2004.htm

So what is the current situation?

Of the five wolves scheduled to be shot, three have already been killed, including the alpha female of a pack that was supposed to be “spared” by the cull. In my opinion there is little that can be done to stop this current hunt, but judging from the past attitude of the Norwegian government it will not be the last one.

So what can be done about it?

Well, unless you want to hop over to Norway and stand between the wolves and the hunters (and there are some people who are doing just that) what you can do is write write and write.

Before you do write anywhere consider this though, if you want to be credible, you will need to be polite, and to the point. Express your concerns and your fears, but avoid anything which could be construed as insulting, no matter how much you feel like strangling the people responsible for this. Unless you remain polite your letter will be disregarded.

First you can write to the Norwegian ambassador in your country, expressing your feelings on this issue. Norway might not have an embassy in your country, in that case just write to the closest one. Here is a list. The point of this would be to let the Norwegians know you are not happy about this.

The next thing you can do is write to the people in your own country expressing your concern, contact environmental agencies, conservation groups, whomever you think might be interested and would need to know about this. Two points to this, on the one hand an informative point to let people who might feel concerned about this know what is happening, and on the other hand to try to see if they can do something. Probably not very much, but a lot of small efforts pay out in the long run.

Finally you can write to your MEP (members of the European Parliament). Even though Norway is not actually a member of the EU, by authorizing these culls of protected species it is in direct violation of the “Convention on the Conservation of European Wildlife and Natural Habitats (Bern Convention,1979)” which it ratified in 1989. Under this convention Canis lupus is classed as appendix II species (strictly protected species) meaning that the regulated hunting of wolves is prohibited. Since this document was drawn under the auspices of the Council of Europe (one of the EU organisms) it is appropriate to bring this issue up with your MEP. You can find out who they are and how to contact them here.

Having been nailed to my bed for most of the weekend, I’ve only had time to track this information down and have not yet been able to draft my letters, but should any of you think they might be useful I don’t have a problem sharing them with the forum.

Remember, one voice can make a difference in the end.
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Old 02-02-2005, 22:04   #6
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Sorry for responding that late.

The Norwegian government decission of killing one family group was based on the fact that one of the family groups in a certain area was said to be too much habituaded, that is become too much familiar to humans, livestock and environment and by that lost their natural shyness and became a possible threath to human and livestock including dogs.

During the last 10 years it's reported that wolf has killed approx 110 dogs, some in the backyards of family property.

Four species of the family group was killed, one escaped and a another fifth wolf was killed by mistake. This wolf was shot outside the protected area of her pack. The local authorities are now applying for licence to shoot the remaining member of the pack of five.
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Old 02-02-2005, 22:28   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
Four species of the family group was killed, one escaped and a another fifth wolf was killed by mistake. This wolf was shot outside the protected area of her pack. The local authorities are now applying for licence to shoot the remaining member of the pack of five.
yppie ya-hoo! GO ON WITH THE HUNT ! KILL'EM ALL ! Togheter with the wales
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Old 02-02-2005, 22:48   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navarre
yppie ya-hoo! GO ON WITH THE HUNT ! KILL'EM ALL ! Togheter with the wales
Pardon me?
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Old 02-02-2005, 22:55   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
During the last 10 years it's reported that wolf has killed approx 110 dogs, some in the backyards of family property.
110? I have an other nice statistics. It is about the topic: Who is more dangerous in Slovakia?

"There are over 50000 people which go hunting to the forest in Slovakia. In the year 2000 they killed 9 916 deers, 15 751 roe deers, 15 926 wild boars and 13 116 dogs (!). They are also the reason why many people are killed and other tens wounded."

And for the end - another statistics about "Number of animals killed every year by the hunters and wolves in Slovakia". The description under the graph shows as follows (from the left to right): red deers, wild boars, roe deers, hawks, crows, magpies, jays and people (by wolves=0)



And don't forget there are hundreds of wolves in Slovakia!

BTW: We have a lot more than 1000 wolves living in Poland and it doesn't mean they kill 10000 dogs every year... Sure they kill also dogs but to be honest it apply mostly to homeless dogs runnig wild... Because they are easy prey.....
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Old 02-02-2005, 23:28   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margo
BTW: We have a lot more than 1000 wolves living in Poland and it doesn't mean they kill 10000 dogs every year... Sure they kill also dogs but to be honest it apply mostly to homeless dogs runnig wild... Because they are easy prey.....
Even so, the nearness of the wolf and the fact that one pack has shown typical lack of shyness has scared people. I do understand that people may fear a wolf crossing their own yard and killing their dogs by their entrance.

Of course these wolves might have be trapped and transfered to other areas, - but protected areas are rare and occupied be other family groups.

I'm not in favor of this killing, and from my point of view it is wrong, - but the resistance against wolves are from certain groups considerable, - and this year a governmental election is taking place...
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Old 02-02-2005, 23:50   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
Even so, the nearness of the wolf and the fact that one pack has shown typical lack of shyness has scared people. I do understand that people may fear a wolf crossing their own yard and killing their dogs by their entrance.
Sure - but don't you think it is strange that in so huge country like Norway there are only 25 wolves and there are already problems with them? There must be something wrong....

We had also similar cases here and there are some wolves killed which were not affraid of people. But (almost) always people were guilty for it:
- sometimes because they took puppies from the burrows and left them in forest when the wolves were adult
- sometimes there was not enough food in the forest
- sometimes people "domesticated" wolves so they were no more affraid
- but in the most cases the people just say the wolves are dangerous simply because they hate them (don't forget wolves are the biggest competitors for hunters and...poachers and danger for unprotected herd).
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Old 03-02-2005, 00:32   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margo

Sure - but don't you think it is strange that in so huge country like Norway there are only 25 wolves and there are already problems with them? There must be something wrong....
The reinforcement of wolves is a bilateral Swedish/Norwegian agreement. The the protected areas are on both sides of the border and the areas are the natural habitat of the wolves. Even so, stray wolves are occationally observed way off the protected area. One or two have been shot, others are killed by train or by cars. ( Even not far from my property stray wolves occationally passes by more than once a year,)

Inside or close to the area are several local comunities and widespread farms. The areas are remote, the kids are bussed to school and have to wait for transportation along the side of the roads- sometimes in temperatures below 20 centigrades and large amount of snow.

(The rest have to wait for tomorrow )
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Old 03-02-2005, 15:26   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
The reinforcement of wolves is a bilateral Swedish/Norwegian agreement. The the protected areas are on both sides of the border and the areas are the natural habitat of the wolves. Even so, stray wolves are occationally observed way off the protected area.
Does it mean that Norwegian authorities and local people expect wolves to obey administrative regulations? And if wolves don't follow the rules they should be exterminated?
Quote:
One or two have been shot, others are killed by train or by cars. (
Sorry, but I don't follow your line of argument. I understand these have just been unfortunate accidents... which should lead to more intensive/efficient protection of wolves rather than shooting them...
Quote:
Even not far from my property stray wolves occationally passes by more than once a year,)
There are many more wolves in much more densly populated coutries than Norway. Statistics show that more poeple are shot /wounded accidentaly by hunters than attacked by wolves (almost none). Logical reasoning would lead to an absurd conclusion that hunters should be exterminated?
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Old 04-02-2005, 18:40   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rona
Does it mean that Norwegian authorities and local people expect wolves to obey administrative regulations? And if wolves don't follow the rules they should be exterminated?
'course not
The "Norwegian" wolves are fully protected by law. The only exception is if wolves are *observed* killing livestock. To prevent further loss such wolves might be shot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rona
There are many more wolves in much more densly populated coutries than Norway. Statistics show that more poeple are shot /wounded accidentaly by hunters than attacked by wolves (almost none). Logical reasoning would lead to an absurd conclusion that hunters should be exterminated?
By tracking stray wolves it shows that they do not only stay in the wilderness. A map of the route of a stray wolf in the southern part of Norway showed that this individual at a large distance followed county and main roads and even passed very close to housing estates and in the outskirt of comunity centers. The population along the route was advised to show special care for their livestock and pets.

The WWF-Norway and cooperating enviromental organizations are protesting against the killing accusing the Government not to listen to the experts and have brought this sad case to trial. The Minister of Enviroment of Sweden regreted that the Norwegian Minister did not care neither to inform her nor to listen to the experts regarding the matter before the decission of killing was made.

And at least - one of our political parties announced today that in the forthcomming governmental elections the extermination of all Norwegian wolf family groups will be campaigned.
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Old 04-02-2005, 19:28   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
The "Norwegian" wolves are fully protected by law. The only exception is if wolves are *observed* killing livestock. To prevent further loss such wolves might be shot.
ah OK, nice kind of protection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
And at least - one of our political parties announced today that in the forthcomming governmental elections the extermination of all Norwegian wolf family groups will be campaigned.
I thought that Berlusconi was the worst thing that could happen to a civil country, but there is ever something worser...
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Old 04-02-2005, 21:26   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perolav
The Minister of Enviroment of Sweden regreted that the Norwegian Minister did not care neither to inform her nor to listen to the experts regarding the matter before the decission of killing was made.
No wonder she was angry Especially if you share the wolves with the Swedish

Quote:
And at least - one of our political parties announced today that in the forthcomming governmental elections the extermination of all Norwegian wolf family groups will be campaigned.
You had better hurry up with the elections . Otherwise, you may end up with no more wolves to protect
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Old 04-02-2005, 22:43   #17
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WOLF SLAUGHTER IN NORWAY YET AGAIN

Petition:
STOP THE EXTERMINATION OF THE WOLF IN NORWAY
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Old 05-02-2005, 21:54   #18
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Margo's qouted links gives a fairly good summary of the situation.
Due to our experts the Norwegian protected area is large enough housing 3 family groups. Before the killing two groups were living inside the protected area and one group outside the area.

The family group living outside the protected area minus one individual was killed. In addition the female alpha of a family living inside the protected area was killed. This alpha female who carrying a radio collar was killed ouside the protected area. By killing the alpha female this family is broken-up. According to experts this may lead to far more killing of sheep..

In addition the links quoted in Margo's last posting, the Norwegian Alpha-group http://www.alpha-gruppen.com/alpha_purpose.htm is deeply concerned about the situation.
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Old 05-02-2005, 23:06   #19
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Terriblle arguments - wolfs are under protection if they live in a special area! If they move 1 m out they should be shot!
Its not a protection, its a concentration camp!!!
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Old 05-02-2005, 23:46   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
Terriblle arguments - wolfs are under protection if they live in a special area! If they move 1 m out they should be shot!
Its not a protection, its a concentration camp!!!
No, - that's not the point.
The Government has declared a protected area for wolf family groups. According to our experts this zone will provide space and prey for 3 family groups - remember : close to this area is pastures for sheep, cows, tame reindeer etc. If the number of wolf family groups exceed the number of 3 (20 individuals) more attacks on livestock may be expected, and the conflict will increase. It may also lead to poaching or poisoning of the wolves.

As said before: the wolves are protected by law, but in order to avoid extraordinary killing of livestock followed by killing of wolves, the number of wolves must bekept in accordance with the recommendations given by the experts.
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