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Sport & training Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs as working dogs - how to train, how to teach new elements, information about competitions and training seminars...

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Old 19-08-2004, 23:10   #21
krivic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray
hi
i agree with letty, i personally don't have expeirience with an electric colar but i consulted my trainer after i read this post. the only dogs that i have seen that were trained with such a colar were unhandble, verry bad tempered dogs. by the sound of your dog it seems to me he is not like that and i wodn't do that to a dog because ther is a 10% chance he might be bad.
pain leads to pain
my trainer is an amazing trainer and i will gladly ask him anything, if you wish.
ray
Hi,

1 a man can "use" an electric collar on his own neck - it is not a pain collar any more. (read the replies above), but as the users say - more like an invisible leash.
2 I asume that your trainer doesn't have an experience with CSW and/or with a modern electric collar.

this is my last reply, because I'm beggining to sound like an electric collar producer, although I only wanted some reports from electric collar users (but got mainly from the rest!)

good bye and thanks for the real replies (past and future)
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Old 20-08-2004, 21:53   #22
Koos
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Hello again,

You just has written, that you wanted to know anything about users with worked with the electric collar.
I wanted to tell you, that the electric collars are forbidden in Holland to train with. All dogs which are trained with the electric collars are trained illegal with this collar, so I think that less people will answer you from Holland.
Of course I have seen dogs training with this collars and I have to say that they obey very good but after the time they haven't this collar on the neck, they didn't obey as well as they wearing it. Even they didn't obey at all. And these were really sport dogs. So what a sence has this collar??


Greatings,

Letty
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Old 04-09-2004, 20:29   #23
Meisel
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When you cant get your dog to listen to you with normal training,you give him an electric collar???
Get real,are you stupid.
If your dog goes after wild pray...you keep him on a leash.
If your dog cant be trusted with children,keep him away from them.
This is not only for Csw but fore all dogs,its as simple as that.
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Old 04-09-2004, 23:40   #24
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I do not have any experience with an electrical collar with my dogs so maybe I should just shut up and read.
The fact is that I am trying to understand and would be happy if anyone of you could help me.
I go to training with my two CSW 2 or 3 times a week.
The training done is very soft, trying to change the way of training each time because our CSW soon get bored, they need each time something new.
I started when Oliver was 17 months, so quite grown up.
He makes quite a hassle when in contact with other males.
With humans he is even to friendly!!!
The main thing I appreciate from our training work is the great RESPECT my dog has for me, the great TRUST he has for me, the great CONFIDENCE he has in me.
I couldn't think of using an electrical collar, I think it would be TOO MUCH.
I like to think that hearing my voice for him should work even better than an electrical impulse.
Probably I'm wrong...maybe not.
2 small examples, meaning nothing, just interprete it as you want:
1) the other day a lady from a different training camp came to our camp asking us to use it for 20 mins because her other camp was shut.
She has a GS and uses electrical collar.
The dog was obeying brilliantly and the lady was kind of showing off...
The dog sometimes was not understanding her comands and so making mistakes: she was shouting at him and kicking his bottom becasue of the mistakes (she was NOT using the collare at that moment).
In our camp NEVER have I seen a dog being hit or kicked.
2) I was with my two CSW in a small fenced area specially for dogs.2 separate areas to keep dogs apart.
There were various small dogs (males and females) and so I put Oliver, my 2 years old male in one area and Lunatica, my 10 months old female, in another together with all the other dogs. Oliver is too dominant so I'm scared he would annoy the other males. He would not harm them but just for playing he would toss them around and step on them and the owners don't like that...
Well, while I was in one area Oliver just JUMPED the fence (1.6m) and entered our area where all the other dogs also males, were.
I didn't know what to do so I shouted SIIIIIT!!!.
He sat, instantly.
I was amazed....my voice, just my voiced, worked like an electrical impulse...
Respect works more than electricity!!!!
Massimo
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Old 06-09-2004, 11:23   #25
Jeffrey
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First i'd like to state, if you havent tried it yourself, then dont use it on your dogs.

I'm a kind of extreme type and my dogs, I'm a surfer, always walk without a colar or line ( that is between sheep, on beaches, with goats and other dogs, people). A the start they wanted to play with everybody, eat sheep and goats and bite cows horses and everything that is to big to kill. I didn't know what to do and so I thought about using a e-colar and thats why I tried it myself.

I can tell you all, dont use it on your dog. I test it with a shawl on my own neck and had muscle pain for a week (light pulse), and i'm a fully trained guy. Instead i decided to put in more effort and love, while leaving them without colar or line. After 4 months the dogs dont play with unknown people and they dont go for the sheep and goats no more, why?

Because I fucking trained and love them. I chose for this dogs, I chose the leave them free, I chose to.........

And I choose not to hassle my dogs on a manner that is disrespectfull towards everything we should stand for owning a nature dog. If you cant cope with the character of your dog (thats is emotionaly or in specific situations you made a wrong choise). A dog that listens for a 100%, come on no body is that stupid!

Kind regards,

Jeffrey
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Old 06-09-2004, 17:06   #26
Meisel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffrey
First i'd like to state, if you havent tried it yourself, then dont use it on your dogs.

I'm a kind of extreme type and my dogs, I'm a surfer, always walk without a colar or line ( that is between sheep, on beaches, with goats and other dogs, people). A the start they wanted to play with everybody, eat sheep and goats and bite cows horses and everything that is to big to kill. I didn't know what to do and so I thought about using a e-colar and thats why I tried it myself.

I can tell you all, dont use it on your dog. I test it with a shawl on my own neck and had muscle pain for a week (light pulse), and i'm a fully trained guy. Instead i decided to put in more effort and love, while leaving them without colar or line. After 4 months the dogs dont play with unknown people and they dont go for the sheep and goats no more, why?

Because I fucking trained and love them. I chose for this dogs, I chose the leave them free, I chose to.........

And I choose not to hassle my dogs on a manner that is disrespectfull towards everything we should stand for owning a nature dog. If you cant cope with the character of your dog (thats is emotionaly or in specific situations you made a wrong choise). A dog that listens for a 100%, come on no body is that stupid!

Kind regards,

Jeffrey
Could not say it any better!!
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Old 22-09-2004, 20:35   #27
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To hopefully enlighten some, I would suggest that you go on-line to www.fredhassen.com and then consider this newer training method in the States. Prior to perusing this site, I will tell you that the collar is $200 USA dollars.
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Old 01-10-2004, 16:41   #28
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I have an 8 month old doberman. I've been taking him for obedience training since he was 10 weeks old. I haven't used the electric collor myself, but they do use it successfully in the traning school I take him to. I've been around the dogs that have been trained with these (other dobermans) and they are not wild, crazy, or unhandable; quite the opposite. It does seem that one can use these collors with success, although I'm sure one could also abuse them as well. From talking to the traininer, they use the electric collor in two cases: (1) to correct a bad behavior (jumping, chasing, etc.) (2) as a training aid to help the dog understand that he/she needs to respond to a single command immediately without any hesitation ( gets a correction right away when no response ). The dog is usually trained and undestands all the commands by the time they start using the collor, but is not necessarily listening/obeing all the time.

If training my dobe with such a collor would give me enough confidence to let him off leash at a park to play with him by throwing some tennis balls or frizbee and knowing that he'll obey even when other dogs/cats/children are around or when he's chasing something into a busy street, I think it might be worth some discomfort to the animal in the long run. In addition, by all means use any other traditional methods that will help to achive your behavior goals like a long line and calling him to come when distracted. Personally I don't think getting yanked by a pinch collor is that much better then getting a small electic stimulation however. I'm not convinced yet myself if I'll want to use such a collor but I am considering it. I'm doing my research now and this is my current opinion. It may or may not change
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Old 28-10-2004, 01:43   #29
Nebulosa
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I find this measure very drastic, would be more easy to accustom the animal with the child, this coleira is a negative way to teach the animal, you would like that each time that to make something wrong, to be punished with that goes to make to feel a sensation to it ackward, thinks about this before taking any measure with the dog.
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Old 29-10-2004, 02:03   #30
ligerwolve
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Hello everybody it's me again. I was just wondering if you have heard of another type of collar thats available over the net. Instead of releasing an electric shock it spray a foul smelling and tasting liquid in front of the dogs face. I havent needed to use it myself but Ive heard good things and it seems less harmful. The sray is harmless and doesnt sting and you can change it to your own formula. Perhaps if you are really worried you can use this. My Akayla( my dog) had a strong prey drive, her previous owner encouraged this. Which is one reason he was going to have her put to sleep. he said she couldnt be trained properly as she was too eager. What rubbish! Within 6 months Akayla has stopped this behaviour and I know I can trust her off the leash. Trust me whan I say training is the best way. Akayla no longer has a taste for motorbikes, birds, cats or small dogs. She would have torn any of these things apart before. Good luck with things, the only person who can really tell you what to do is the dog itself.
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