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Sport & training Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs as working dogs - how to train, how to teach new elements, information about competitions and training seminars...

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Old 17-04-2006, 14:22   #1
Per Olav
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Default The CSV as therapy dog

The CSV as comunity service dogs

Hi.

I remember I somewhere, sometime having read of the CSV in comunity service as therapy dogs. I wonder if it happened just in my dreams or not If not in my dreams I 'll appreciate more information on the subject.
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Old 18-04-2006, 11:18   #2
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Hello Per Olav,
I think, nobody has wolfdog like dog for therapy (canisterapie).
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Old 18-04-2006, 11:39   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanka
I think, nobody has wolfdog like dog for therapy (canisterapie).
No - there are already some....

Two dogs from our kennel work already with children. Alistair Wolf z Peronowki works at the moment in such group. So far she had some lessons with children. She is not "typical" therapy dog because her task is to show healty or less handicapped children that "wolves" are not bad animals....

But Ela takes at the moment part in a proffesional training for people which will work in canisterapie with their dogs. Amber Wolf z Peronowki makes such training for a longer time already.... Now Ela has also new female which is trained for this work from the first weeks of her life (since she left the breeder's home and moved to Ela)....

Sure CzW are no the best breed for such work (for example because of their look ) and only few of them fit for it (when we take into consideration their character) but we will see how it develops... Anyway we keep fingers for them...
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Old 18-04-2006, 12:49   #4
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My dogs Chezka (Berta z vlei chaloupky) and (Crying wolf) Karlik are not official certificated therapy dogs, but we use them very often in groups with difficult young people. They make for example contact with "the "un reachenable" ones. They give also calming signals in the group, they want to be hugged by very shy aso. A lot of these young people did tell these dogs are the most importent for them in world And it is amazing to see on how many mobilephones their picture is in the backround

We also have experience with autistic kids. And it is amazing to see how woldogs (saarloos and CsW) behave with these kids and make contact with them.
I think a lot of people don't realise how sensitive wolfdogs are!

Oebie Kadir van de Ursidae-Stee does the same in Holland as Alistair Wolf z Peronowki She was several times on schools to show "wolves" are not bad animals
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Old 18-04-2006, 13:07   #5
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So, sorry about my bad meaning. Congratulations, you are "first svallow". )
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Old 18-04-2006, 13:25   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanka
I think, nobody has wolfdog like dog for therapy (canisterapie).
No - there are already some....

Two dogs from our kennel work already with children. Alistair Wolf z Peronowki works at the moment in such group. So far she had some lessons with children. She is not "typical" therapy dog because her task is to show healty or less handicapped children that "wolves" are not bad animals....

But Ela takes at the moment part in a proffesional training for people which will work in canisterapie with their dogs. Amber Wolf z Peronowki makes such training for a longer time already.... Now Ela has also new female which is trained for this work from the first weeks of her life (since she left the breeder's home and moved to Ela)....

Sure CzW are no the best breed for such work (for example because of their look ) and only few of them fit for it (when we take into consideration their character) but we will see how it develops... Anyway we keep fingers for them...
That's information of great interest. I wonder if it's possible to have a summary/information of the training/work of the csv as canisterapie dogs and if there are photos taken showing this.

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Old 18-04-2006, 22:50   #7
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Default The CSV as therapy dog

My wolfdogs aren`t therapy dogs, but sometimes I take them to school (as I`m working as a teacher for children up to ten years). So both of them, the children and the dogs, are socialized to each other and get friends. It is also a way for me to bring a little "nature" into the classroom because there are some children that are even afraid of birds, beatles, dirt... although we live in the country.
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Old 18-04-2006, 22:56   #8
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Default The CSV as therapy dog

Certainly, they are afraid of beetles, may be also of the Beatles!
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Old 19-04-2006, 18:21   #9
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Hello!
As Margo said I work with my Wolfdogs and with childrean.
I start to work, in fact I'm still educating myself.
Months ago I contacted with people trainig dogs and other people to know more about dogotheraphy.
Now I'm finishing a year-long study to be an instructor of this kind of theraphy and I'm still learning.

My dog AMBER passed internal exams and worked as a theraphy dog. He has perfect patient, childrean can do eveything with him, if he feel pain he only cry.

Here are Amber's fotos
http://www.dogoterapia.org/strona/po...otogaleria.htm

But it was too little for me. I wanted to have a dog trained from the begining.
In november I took a female BETI and I train her for theraphy dog. She already had 3 tests and passed well, we are waiting for an external exam. From the beginning I prepare her to this work.
BETI is a very calm Wolfdog, she loves all people and loves to be close, to be touched. She is young but very obiedent.
(sorry my English is geting worst)
Now she is 7 months old and once a week she is working with childrean that need a special theraphy.

Perolav - an article I can write when I will work longer.





more fotos on prive
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Old 19-04-2006, 18:38   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
more fotos on prive
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Ela

I love you, love you - do you hear - I love you
Thank you so very much - Yes please do write an article.

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Old 19-04-2006, 19:14   #11
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This show one much good image of the breed !
It's good for the people that say "CzWs are dangerous and one breed that if cannot trust", or for they that have ban this breed of the country because is one " wolfdog" like that happen in UK.
Dog therapy is not for all dogs.

Congratulations!!
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Old 19-04-2006, 20:37   #12
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Hi Ela,

What a great pictures!!!!

It is a pitty that I don't understand Polish And I hope that some day there is also more information in English language on the site www.dogoterapia.org

Best regards,

Mijke
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Old 20-04-2006, 08:29   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margo
Alistair Wolf z Peronowki works at the moment in such group. So far she had some lessons with children.
Ooooppps - I see I made a mistake. Alistair is next Wolfdog with the right character for such work of course but because of lack of freetime we can not work with her....
So I meant here Andariel Wolf z Peronowki and her owner Daniel - they both work with a canistherapists' group from Lodz....
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Old 20-04-2006, 12:26   #14
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I genuinely admire Ela and her work with sick children but on seeing the photos I had some second thoughts and mixed feelings which I want to share with you.
The pictures are great but should some of them really be published on-line?

I'm afraid that after seeing the photos from the link provided, some stupid people will begin training their dogs to lick the backs, etc. and call themselves and their dogs therapists. If sufficiently irresponsible and unethical, they may even try to make money on this!

It's only my personal view, but I think one should be very cautious with publishing such pictures and select them carefully so they are not instructive, e.g. like the ones in the topic. Not only dogs and their owners are involved here (as in most pictures in the wolfdog gallery) but also helpless children and their sometimes desperate to help them parents.


It's nothing personal, Ela; you know I'm a great fan of Amber and Beti and wish them and you all the best. You're doing a really fantastic and pioneer job and evereybody appreciates it.
However, I belive it is better to be very careful. (even too careful) and anticipate the possible hazards BEFORE anything happens than to be sorry AFTER.
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Old 20-04-2006, 16:49   #15
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Rona,

I have to disagree with you on this. I think it is very important to show people, that CSW´s can be used even as therapy dogs. There is never enough of good advertisement for the breed.
Also, you see that Ela mentioned, that:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
Months ago I contacted with people trainig dogs and other people to know more about dogotheraphy.
Now I'm finishing a year-long study to be an instructor of this kind of theraphy and I'm still learning.

My dog AMBER passed internal exams and worked as a theraphy dog.
In november I took a female BETI and I train her for theraphy dog. She already had 3 tests and passed well, we are waiting for an external exam. From the beginning I prepare her to this work.
It is clear that canistherapy (or dogotherapy) cannot be done just by anyone. You have to contact people, train the dog and train yourself, pass tests etc.
Of course, anything can be misused by bad people. But that does not mean that Ela should sit at home. If we would think like this about everything, we´d still sit on trees.
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Old 20-04-2006, 17:14   #16
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Hi Rona
You are right but we have a permition from each one parent of our childrean to publish thier photos.
We have papers on it.
I'm not publishing the photos on my page, you can see them on a page of dogotheraphy.

Other thing - I hope nobody will think that Wolfdogs are dogs for theraphy!!!
Some Wolfdogs (I hope) can be use: selected and trained.
I try to examine this, I know thier + and - .
If you want to do best theraphy just take Golden or Labrador.

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Old 20-04-2006, 19:23   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirkawolf1
But that does not mean that Ela should sit at home. If we would think like this about everything, we´d still sit on trees.
Mirka,
I'm afraid you didn't read my post carefully or misunderstood it completely. I never said that Ela should stop training dogs or that I didn't appreciate her efforts. On the contrary! I'm convinced that this is one of the activities where some CSVs can show their full potential and be very successful. Ela is a responsible person, a doctor, and she knows well what she's doing.

I only mentioned my doubts concernning the SELECTION of photos as a broader problem which accidentally cropped out in this topic.! It is important to show that CSVs may be used for therapy, but at the same time the possibilities of misusing the photos should be limited to absolute minimum. Pictures of dogs sitting or lying by the sick children are "innocent" in my opinion, but the ones which show the actual therapeutical techniques may be "dangerous" if used for wrong purposes, by greedy, irresponsible people who browse the Internet in search of "easy" opportunities.

CSVs and PR of the breed are important, but the goodwill of the sick children even more... We shouldn't make life easy for dishonest pseudo-therapists. This problem has nothing to do with Ela or her dogs, which I made very clear in my first post.
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Old 20-04-2006, 19:45   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
You are right but we have a permition from each one parent of our childrean to publish thier photos.
No doubt about that But again, this is not the problem I raised.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
I'm not publishing the photos on my page, you can see them on a page of dogotheraphy.
I did send Per Olav a link to your page and mentioned that the actual healing techniques were probably kept confidential by the therapists in the best interest of the kids. That's why I was so surprised to find them on-line on the official "dogoterapia" page.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
Other thing - I hope nobody will think that Wolfdogs are dogs for theraphy!!!
Some Wolfdogs (I hope) can be use: selected and trained.
Ela, you wouldn't believe to what extent people tend to belive in what they wish to believe I personally think that CSVs are best at what their masters are good at and truly involved in. That's why I predict Amber and Beti will become very successful therapists
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Old 20-04-2006, 21:17   #19
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Rona,

I do not see anything wrong on the pictures. I brought recently several dog magazines from Czech republic, at least in two of them are articles about canistherapy, including similar photos, that Ela just posted. Those dog magazines are national, so really many people can see the photos. And both the journalist and the canistherapeuts do not see anything bad on printing them publicly.

You can´t just take a child, put him on the ground and a dog under his legs. Yes, everyone who reads a bit about canistherapy and dogs as such will know, that warming the childs body using the dog helps to ease the spasm of the sick child. But that does not mean, that everyone can do it and every dog can be used.

As a journalist myself, I visited once canistherapeut society called Pomocne tlapky in order to write article about them. I was shown how the dogs are trained, what they can do, I was invited to different events. And I was shown and offered and e-mailed many photos, such as the one´s Ela posted. Why? To print them out in our newspapers and show how the dogs are helping.

Website of Pomocne tlapky (Helping paws) can be seen here:
http://www.pomocnetlapky.cz/english/index.html

And on their site you can also find photos such as Ela posted. For example here: http://www.pomocnetlapky.cz/asistenc...nka1/arin1.htm

Maybe in Czech republic people have different view on this topic. But I really do not see anything wrong on the photos, neither on the fact that Ela posted them. I think Ela is doing great job and cross my fingers for her to continue well with both her dogs.
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Old 20-04-2006, 21:33   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirkawolf1
Rona,

I do not see anything wrong on the pictures. I brought recently several dog magazines from Czech republic, at least in two of them are articles about canistherapy, including similar photos, that Ela just posted. Those dog magazines are national, so really many people can see the photos. And both the journalist and the canistherapeuts do not see anything bad on printing them publicly.

You can´t just take a child, put him on the ground and a dog under his legs. Yes, everyone who reads a bit about canistherapy and dogs as such will know, that warming the childs body using the dog helps to ease the spasm of the sick child. But that does not mean, that everyone can do it and every dog can be used.

As a journalist myself, I visited once canistherapeut society called Pomocne tlapky in order to write article about them. I was shown how the dogs are trained, what they can do, I was invited to different events. And I was shown and offered and e-mailed many photos, such as the one´s Ela posted. Why? To print them out in our newspapers and show how the dogs are helping.

Maybe in Czech republic people have different view on this topic. But I really do not see anything wrong on the photos, neither on the fact that Ela posted them. I think Ela is doing great job and cross my fingers for her to continue well with both her dogs.
I completely agree with Mirkawolf and from my point of view the photos from Ela are superb showing the dogs and the children in complete harmony, a situation far from the crippeled view of the breed that our Ministry of Justice has adopted from those who were fronting the Norwegian ban of the breed.

I do hope of the kind assistance from Ela and others to fight the ban in words and pictures by informing the Norewgian visitors of my site of the versatility of our breed.
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