I'll bring this topic to the attention of the club. I hope Oskar and Stefik will think something out. But remember the problems we had with Mutaras? This might turn out the same way.

No, it is something totally different. Please correct me if I'm wrong but the Mutaras were registered in Italy on the official way. Maybe it is moral not correct and maybe the Italian judges were wrong registering them as Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs and not "Saarloos wolfhounds" but the dogs were registered according the FCI rules (telling about the registries). It is why it was not possuble to remove the pedigrees of the dogs. But also why we can easily follow all the Saarloos_CsW mixes living and bred in Italy.

What apply by Italian dogs is the European law about the protected speces and wild dangerous animals saing that for keeping the F1-F4 mixes you nee special permissions.

French case is something totally different. The hybrids are not put in the register but they were registered thanks to CHEATING - with falsification of the FCI pedigrees. And it IS breaking of the FCI regulations and a FRAUD. FCI and SCC must do anything with it if they want to keep their reliability. If they will ignore this case NONE of the FCI pedigrees can be taken serious as it would show that you can fabricate the pedigrees and nobody by SCC or FCI cares for it.

Second: in some cases the animals are F1 and F2 which are forbiden to keep without any permissions. So it is also breaking of the European Union law for keeping of the wild animals (it was already mentioned here).

So, Frank...

Will you test your dogs or not :? ???

It is a yes and no question, but can be very hard to answer anyway :p
But I hope you will give it a try...

Very best regards / Mikael

I wonder if it really is legal to write stuff like this without any proof to put on table, and why does not some higher instance then clear this out once for all, I think nobody here ever will be able to find out the truth by discussing who looks like what, that is no proof, sorry I find this little bit sad ?
I mean who are anybody of us to judge, somebody that writing peolpe here maybe not have seen, met or spoken to, I find this a thread that should be closed.


And Admin, I have Golden Eye son of Blood's Lykan. I'm very sad to read this, saarloos? He has excellent open caracter, and he is puppy, you can not from pictures say how he will be when adult.
And first of all you stole my pictures from facebook or someplace of him. Then I put up own, and you IMMEDIATELY try to find some fault with him. To talk about Frank even more. Please find out eveidence to show us before writing stuff like this. I suppose it is easy on a world wide forum to write stuff, but I think it is also sad of grown up people.

And Gabyäne, that you have put like sister to Golden Eye, are you sure she is from same litter :) If owner not put up the facts, because I do not know but she looks more like like from the other litter to mee, Frank had other litter too.

Well have a nice midsummer everybody, I will spend it with my dogs !!

This is my last post forever on this site. I find all discussions here really crazy...

Jenny
www.foreverwolf.nettisivu.org

Please read the topic one more time. There are already people who have proves that de La Louve blanche use American Wolfdogs and mix them with CsW. Several specialist judges say openly the same - that some of the dogs by the mentioned kennel are not purebreed Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs. It is what we all can see very easy.

But nobody want only to TALK about it. And to accuse anybody but IT MUST BE STOPED and the problem MUST BE SOLVED. Several French breeders already complained that they used the "suspicious dogs" and not they are not sure if their puppies are purebreed or not. Only because someone is cheatng the pedigrees it has influence on the WHOLE French population. And not only French.
Over and over again we ask the French kennel club to start testing and to remove the mutts (take away the pedigrees of the dogs which are CSW-AWD-mixes).

Believe me - we all have the same goals. We want to be sure that every CsW with the FCI pedigree is a CSW and that the parents listed in the pedigree are real parents of this dog. I hope the official DNA tests will be done as soon as possible and the whole problem will be solved as soon as possible.

But why do you complain Backman?
You dont' know your dog is a mix?Have you find in him a little think of Ashoka,Voice,Amore Mio or Arys ?

Destroy your fake pedigree and nobody will haunt more you and your strange mix dogs

You invoked the law and fairness and then you disappear dogs and entered the mix dogs in their place

I am glad that wolfdog.org is finally opening his eyes

I'm ready if you need, to offer all the support in the future for any economic and legal proceedings,and I am deeply grateful to you for the task of unmasking these impostors

The situation in Italy is extremely worrying, and I hope that the italian club instead of commenting and make compliments to mix on facebook will finally decides to act and do something

think that a baby mix coming from France, and arrived here a few weeks ago, has already many pre-reservations from (well know) italian breeders

but above all for a great effect emulation (great breeders who use mix and selling their dogs to stratospheric price), and saw the unexplained silence of italian club, I assure you that many are starting to use "contaminations" in consideration of the large marketability of these mixes and the morphology incredibly similar to the wolf

Thanks admin.
The time was overdue to bring up this topic.
As soon as I'm back from the South of France, I hopefully can provide you with some new facts.

Dear Ms Bäckman,
I've been working with wolves and dogs on a professional basis for 20 years now.
As well as breeding CSW's for quite a while. We had our M-litter born last December.
Don't try to fool me. I see what I see and know what it (not) is...
Regarding to your website you're a CSW breeder, no honest CSW breeder ever would start breeding with a "de la Louve Blanche" dog from the C-litter onwards.
So either you're stupid or a cheat.
If you're the first I herewith apologize humbly.

Michael

Where are you in the South of France? I live near Marseille and I suggest you seeing my bitch Darwen de la louve blanche to make you an idea in really and not in photo if she is or not a mix.


You can see at the same time the new son of Erik Nanook.

Best time for you admin to do it. it was so long time wait you to write posts. only idiots not see that furyos mixes american tundra wolfdog. idiots or people blind.

before 3 years hanninadina write that furyos sell hybrids with CLC pedigrees - http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showpos...60&postcount=8 on webite was video of hybrid with puppies

2008 i write that he produce mixes like mutara: http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showthread.php?t=9708

and same now about mixes in finalnd: http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showpos...54&postcount=8

very much wating for you to make something. but i hope you will stop cheaters. I know many write bad words but you not wonder. they run big cheaters bussiness. and breeding for money not for breed. is why they scream of you.

i not understand people like you. you know furyos make shit with this breed but you buy next puppy frrom same kennel? next mix and breed new mixes?
you breed CLC. if you not blind you see dog from louve blanche are strange mixes. not wolfdogs.

I'm near Brignoles/Var.
Where are you based?

Michael

I live in Martigues, if you want we can meet in Aix en Provence or Marseille, it is between 2 cities.

You might be 100% right Lupis, but it kind of is hard to act on so caled (fakt´s) coming from somebody that do not even dare to put he´s own name on it :rock_3

Very best regards / Mikael

Yes, as I did say it is a hard one to answer ;-)

And what might be the reasan for that :? ??? Hmmmm...

Best regards / Mikael

I have to laugh or cry? Strangely one week ago when I asked in our very expensively admin for the precise charges has comment of my dog and the precise information about the tests to be made, he never answered.

Especially when it has was proved that darwen is real girl of volos and in comparison of the tests on my dogs with the charges. The presence of a video and photos of the D to litter when it had 10 days.

So very strangely, when we have some concrete : documents, videos and photos opposite have that points of view. I want the real proofs: signed and dated documents, videos, photos and not only opinions of a group of ewes behind a person who hides meanly. I’m quénée tommy (France) owner of devil Grey, proud of the being until proved otherwise. Come on at home when you want.

Just for you Remind the memory I name Margo peron and Daiva Rimaityte ( LT) and suggest you seeing of what they think of our dogs. Look at the place of dogs is saying mix.


http://www.wolfdog.org/fra/shows/3293.html


so you see it is simple : a name followed by a document, have a little of courage.

Later it is the true also, I indicated that the one who had twists for Grey had to pay the tests (I or admin). When I speak about subjective there are a lot of people to answer, when it is necessary to trust in its statements and to play in the yard of the big I meet in front of a big space.

I would answer to the people who prove me their statements, the others who are only speaking or hiding goodbye.

To finish, it must be good for the FCI of knowledge for you, it is only an organization of incompetent. Because judges from their home made multi-champions with mixes (several countries with judges of several countries). You the big experts, it’s going to need to think of creating a school for them.

In the end why to want to put the pedigrees to the trash because the organization which confirms them is incompetent?

Ps: I always wait for my answers of the admin or martial ribouret for more than a week!

why in this ring I not see dogs like demoniak or and others similar dogs? Maybe they know - better not go with this dogs in ring? I realy very, very wait for this dogs in my ring.

and CACS have typical CSV dogs, not Volos or others dogs if You better read a results.

Judge MAS anatomy not purity in show- see diferent? I know dogs who not are CSV with pedigree but have better anatomy like a few dogs who are in first place, organizator who organize show MAS checking dogs purity and put in show only pure dogs, this not are judge problem but organizator.

sory, but if You read a judge reglaments You maybe speak others, but I understand to big problem make this.

Judge not have in his eyes DNA tester for gens, Judge mas judge anatomy not genetic, and if read moore in WD forum You can see - this problem go up now when this dogs have puppy with females who are to much strange too. Maybe better read about Mendels principe in genetic. I think this help You too understand moore about this all- about dogs anatomy and diferents in generation who we and have now.

and ... why I not mate with males from this "strange" dogs list? maybe this are antswer too.

I very good understand You, now You have a stress, when maybe Your dog not are pure dog, but WHY not want explain all this with test, but make big bla bla.

as it was said before - daiva is a fci judge, she is obliged to judge every dog having fci documents regardless of her own ideas about the breed...

Wolfin what do you think about this bitch, pure, mix or saarloos mix???

http://fotoforum.fr/photos/2011/06/26.286.jpg

http://fotoforum.fr/photos/2011/06/26.287.jpg

make DNA parents and grandparents - laboratory say who is who. If want to judgement from my -please coming in ring when I judge.

p.s. but I not want a buy this female puppy- not be angry :)

You have already judged this bitch, 2nd excellent.