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Old 29-04-2011, 23:36   #61
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Haha no I thought we were talking about dog training in general. I would want to get a wolfdog puppy to start with.
In a way I was - but more specifically with regards to the kind of dog you want.

Aggression issues can happen for 2 main reasons, environmental or genetic.

However - exceptions can happen with training. (For example, it is possible to train a dog predisposed to genetic aggression out of it, and is is possibly for a dog with no genetic predisposition to become aggressive through environmental factors.)

Whatever you want - if you are taking on a dog that has been bred for a specific reason or has been developed to do a job, you have to work very carefully through training, you have to bear that in mind when taking on the dog. As Tupac says - there are no guarantees.
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Old 29-04-2011, 23:50   #62
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I (possibly becasue I am a trainer) see all dogs as trainable, however with some breeds (or even individuals) you have to think outside the box. Finding your dogs 'on' switch is always the first (and sometimes most challenging) part of any training (finding an 'off' switch is another!!).
That's what I was trying to say. But, if you want your dog to be trainable and be willing to enter tiny/dark spaces, you need not only good picking and persistence and out-of-the-box training technique, you also need luck, and that one no-one can guarantee. And, in my opinion, wolfdogs remember the bad things very well, so a string of bad luck can turn your well-socialized, inquisitive and well-behaved wolfdog pup to a shy and hysteric adolescent that you will need a lot of time and energy to bring back to what you had before. If one is not sure if wolfdog is the breed for them, I think it is better to anticipate bad luck and such, and be pleasantly surprised, than the other way around.

Maybe it is different in your country, but I am really sick of people who say wolfdogs are no good as working breed, just because they tried to get results in the same way as with GSD or, even worse, BS, and of course failed, and instead of trying different approach, they just got rid of the dog. And of people who tell you to get a nice breed if you come to a training with wolfdog. I mean, if you are willing to give away your present dog for a new one, just because this one is not progressing in the way you wanted, than wolfdog is not a breed for you. We have too much of this kind of approach here, so I rather scare a potential owners away. Wolfdogs can be taught to obey different people and to spend time with strangers and whatever, but they are essentially a one-person dogs.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:02   #63
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That's what I was trying to say. But, if you want your dog to be trainable and be willing to enter tiny/dark spaces, you need not only good picking and persistence and out-of-the-box training technique, you also need luck, and that one no-one can guarantee. And, in my opinion, wolfdogs remember the bad things very well, so a string of bad luck can turn your well-socialized, inquisitive and well-behaved wolfdog pup to a shy and hysteric adolescent that you will need a lot of time and energy to bring back to what you had before. If one is not sure if wolfdog is the breed for them, I think it is better to anticipate bad luck and such, and be pleasantly surprised, than the other way around.

Maybe it is different in your country, but I am really sick of people who say wolfdogs are no good as working breed, just because they tried to get results in the same way as with GSD or, even worse, BS, and of course failed, and instead of trying different approach, they just got rid of the dog. And of people who tell you to get a nice breed if you come to a training with wolfdog. I mean, if you are willing to give away your present dog for a new one, just because this one is not progressing in the way you wanted, than wolfdog is not a breed for you. We have too much of this kind of approach here, so I rather scare a potential owners away. Wolfdogs can be taught to obey different people and to spend time with strangers and whatever, but they are essentially a one-person dogs.
i agree

although i would say,anyone with that mindset should not have any breed of dog.

your dog should be a companion and friend first and foremost, 'sports' or 'jobs' is an added bonus imo.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:16   #64
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although i would say,anyone with that mindset should not have any breed of dog.
I don't like this approach too, but for some people dog is a dog, not a partner. I do not judge them, they have their reasons, but such people should avoid wolfdogs, IMO.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:16   #65
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That's what I was trying to say. But, if you want your dog to be trainable and be willing to enter tiny/dark spaces, you need not only good picking and persistence and out-of-the-box training technique, you also need luck, and that one no-one can guarantee. And, in my opinion, wolfdogs remember the bad things very well, so a string of bad luck can turn your well-socialized, inquisitive and well-behaved wolfdog pup to a shy and hysteric adolescent that you will need a lot of time and energy to bring back to what you had before. If one is not sure if wolfdog is the breed for them, I think it is better to anticipate bad luck and such, and be pleasantly surprised, than the other way around.

Maybe it is different in your country, but I am really sick of people who say wolfdogs are no good as working breed, just because they tried to get results in the same way as with GSD or, even worse, BS, and of course failed, and instead of trying different approach, they just got rid of the dog. And of people who tell you to get a nice breed if you come to a training with wolfdog. I mean, if you are willing to give away your present dog for a new one, just because this one is not progressing in the way you wanted, than wolfdog is not a breed for you. We have too much of this kind of approach here, so I rather scare a potential owners away. Wolfdogs can be taught to obey different people and to spend time with strangers and whatever, but they are essentially a one-person dogs.

I agree - I am learning about these dogs daily (on here). I do not count the Mutt I live with as I believe he takes after his 'other' side!

The time it takes for training has to be a factor - they do not seem to be a dog for people who want instant gratification (months) with regards to training, you would be more looking at long term (years).

CSVs are still rare over here, and (to my knowledge - although Tupac would know more) there are no pure bred who are actually working.

Maybe it is different where they are 'popular' but I guess the looks baring the passing resemblance to the GSD/BSD people assume the trainability will be the same.
From what I have seen they are intelligent - which should mean they can be trained. They have an athletic conformation which also sets them in good stead. However - their development seems quite different, the maturing time and sensitivities?

When I spoke to my old boss (a guy who was in the Czech Army in the 70's) and told him what I had - his instant response was very dismissive. He pretty much told me it was a waste of time, based on his experiences working with them in the Czech army, but I am guessing they were very much in their infancy at this point, and he was used to dogs who were 'easier'.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:36   #66
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Maybe it is different where they are 'popular' but I guess the looks baring the passing resemblance to the GSD/BSD people assume the trainability will be the same.
I agree!! Sometimes I think people [want to] assume CsVs are just "wolf grey" themed GSDs..

Besides.. there aren't two 'looks' to a Vlcak.."more GSD" or "more wolfish". The standard says 'similar to a wolf' - anything else is simply a Vlcak with not much type.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:40   #67
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I agree!! Sometimes I think people [want to] assume CsVs are just "wolf grey" themed GSDs..

Besides.. there aren't two 'looks' to a Vlcak.."more GSD" or "more wolfish". The standard says 'similar to a wolf' - anything else is simply a Vlcak with not much type.
Who believes this?
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:48   #68
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Who believes this?
Oh, I didn't mean you said that!

Simply just that I have seen things like "My CsV is more like its German Shepherd roots and............" mostly in response to appearance.
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Old 30-04-2011, 00:53   #69
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Oh, I didn't mean you said that!

Simply just that I have seen things like "My CsV is more like its German Shepherd roots and............" mostly in response to appearance.
- I joke that my guy has GSD days and Wolfy days (but he is a cross)
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Old 30-04-2011, 01:22   #70
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- I joke that my guy has GSD days and Wolfy days (but he is a cross)
Haha I really like this. It seems these dog really have a lot if personality!! I love this. I think hat I will probably end up doing is get a nice working gsd pup and then later on get a wolfdog. This dog seems like a lot of dog to deal with so I will get my nice working dog and after he is an adult I will look into getting a wolf dog in a few years so I can have more time with the pup. I am not a one dog person btw. I don't think I could only have one dog

I do have another question. I know with other breeds of dogs, they are better off with the opposite sex when living with another dog. For example I have a female gsd, and I get a male wolfdog will they get along better or would it be better to get a female wolfdog?
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Old 30-04-2011, 01:30   #71
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Wolfdogs might have hierarchy issues with other dogs of the same sex, so opposite sex is preferable, but not required (lot of same sex pair live happily, you just need to take the possible ranking into consideration). For wolfdog, you don't need to be a one-dog person, they love to have larger packs. And it is actually good for teaching a young wolfdog to have a dog teacher, they learn amazingly by watching other dogs. It is especially good for teaching commands that are not their strong point - like fetching or barking on command... But, if a wolfdog is your second dog, you need to remember to socialize it also alone - in the absence of the older dog.
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Old 30-04-2011, 01:43   #72
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Wolfdogs might have hierarchy issues with other dogs of the same sex, so opposite sex is preferable, but not required (lot of same sex pair live happily, you just need to take the possible ranking into consideration). For wolfdog, you don't need to be a one-dog person, they love to have larger packs. And it is actually good for teaching a young wolfdog to have a dog teacher, they learn amazingly by watching other dogs. It is especially good for teaching commands that are not their strong point - like fetching or barking on command... But, if a wolfdog is your second dog, you need to remember to socialize it also alone - in the absence of the older dog.

Okay so my gsd is a pretty dominant female. We currently are living at my parents house(I am looking for a house to buy right now) she gets along with my moms dog one is female and one male. The thing about her is that she has NEVER gone looking for a fight and she gets along with other dogs but if a dog runs unto her and jumps all over her she will "pin" them down. It's not violent, she just never gives a warning and does it. She has never hurt a dog doing this. I looks scary to other owners but in my eyes she is just stating her dominance. I take her to the dog park once in a while and she does fine there as long as other dogs are in control of them selfs and walk up to her and do a "normal" greeting.

I was told when I got her that she doesn't really get along with other dominant females. That's why I asked. I would prefer to get a male so that they would likely get along better. Getting a puppy would ofcourse help. I was also told that she had a litter of puppies before and so she has a strong maternal instinct. I have witnessed this my self and it's really cute. Lol
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Old 30-04-2011, 01:57   #73
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The thing about her is that she has NEVER gone looking for a fight and she gets along with other dogs but if a dog runs unto her and jumps all over her she will "pin" them down. It's not violent, she just never gives a warning and does it.
I personally don't see this as "dominance".. just her way of expressing how little she cares for rude introductions/interactions.

None of my four like other dogs jumping all over them.. I gather that MOST dogs wouldn't care for any dog doing that, unless it was mutually initiated and that's their play style.
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Old 30-04-2011, 07:20   #74
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Haha I really like this. It seems these dog really have a lot if personality!! I love this.
Then it's a dog for you
They also tend to show their 'demo version' to visitors, rememeber about it when you go to Marcy

A few days ago Lorka pretended she was a "nice" dog when a couple became interested in the breed. She first licked delicately their extended hands for a welcome, then did 'sit-stay' for over 10 minutes when we were talking, when running unleashed, came to every commad and sat in front of me like a well- trained GSD I was impressed how skillfully and mischeviously she advertised the breed
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Old 30-04-2011, 07:26   #75
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A few days ago Lorka pretended she was a "nice" dog when a couple became interested in the breed. She first licked delicately their extended hands for a welcome, then did 'sit-stay' for over 10 minutes when we were talking, when running unleashed, came to every commad and sat in front of me like a well- trained GSD I was impressed how skillfully and mischeviously she advertised the breed
What?? Is this true?! Lorka, I feel neglected..
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Old 30-04-2011, 07:43   #76
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What?? Is this true?! Lorka, I feel neglected..
Jing, you were a special visitor - you received a "full-love" welcome as if you, your sister and Dan were members of our pack It's much more than just a plain "demo"
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