Northern inuit dog

[Navajo]

The problem in the UK is as already stated that the Czech wolf dog and Saarloos have only just been made legal without the need for licences. If they had been legal in the first place the Inuit/Utonagon e.t.c would not have ever been created. Now that they are legal, the crossing of Czechs and Saarloos with Inuits in the past seems to have ruined the chances of being able to breed pure bred CsV and Saarloos dogs in the Uk for fear of crossing. To us, the chance to have a half CsV or Saarloos was the nearest thing we were going to get to a pure bred and lots of money has been exchanged for these dogs.

What should have happened now that the breeds are legal is for Inuit breeders to have imported the best lines that they could afford to and faded the Inuit out, there is of course no need for a breed that after being bred for the length of time it has, still has very little type and breed standard to continue. The NI also of course being riddled with health issues.

I will agree with the OP though in saying the Inuit and Inuit crosses are lovely dogs and some are real stunners. Please remember GSD breeders may have shared the same opinions and views as many of you when Dr L Saarloos decided to cross the GSD with a wolf.

[saschia]

Well, Navajo, I think GSD breeders had two less things to worry about when both saarlos and czechoslovak wolfdogs were started to be created:

1. passing mixes as purebred with false papers
2. bad public opinion of GSD if such mixes would attack people or destroy property

[Navajo]

Originally Posted by saschia

Well, Navajo, I think GSD breeders had two less things to worry about when both saarlos and czechoslovak wolfdogs were started to be created:

1. passing mixes as purebred with false papers
2. bad public opinion of GSD if such mixes would attack people or destroy property

1. Simple answer is compulsory dna testing, even if it is limited to UK breeders only. When we breed thoroughbreds for racing or point to pointing we have to have them dna tested, a blood sample is also taken and microchipped before Weatherbys will register them as foals. But, I agree, now that the breeds are legal there is no reason to be crossing them whether with Inuits, Wolves or Saarloos x Czech. I don't think it's correct. It will continue though, especially as now Czech and Saarloos breeders in Europe are wary of exporting anything to the Uk. Now UK breeders only have what is already in the UK to work with.

2. I think GSD breeders would have had this concern. There would have been no proof back then as to whether it was the wolf or the GSD in the Czech or Saarloos which was showing agression (if it had happened). I know which I would have had my money on, there's a reason the Armed forces and police use GSD's as protection dogs.

[tikaani]

I think trying to stop people selling CWD to the uk is a narrow minded and stupid thing to do. yes there has been cross breading here in the uk but that dusnt meen every breeder is going to do it. I have a pure breed CWD and inted to breed her in a few years time with a nuther CWD but if there arnt any uther dogs to breed her with what am i supposed to do. you are limating the gene pool over here and thats never a good thing. Now that we are aloud CWD's over here there is no need to cross breed. and hopfully will not hapen any more and as for people selling cross breads as pure i havent herd of that happening here and people have been quite open about that they are selling crosses. there are a lot of resposerble breeders over here pertential owners over here that would love the chance to own a CWD but attitudes like some people on here saying that we shouldnt sell to the uk is just unfair and narrow minded.

[saschia]

tikaani - I agree that not selling pups to Britain is not good. But on the other hand - if I have three pups, where should I sell them - somewhere they will for almost sure be used in good breeding, or somewhere where everybody does whatever they want?

On the other hand - if you have a female, you can come and mate her on the continent. Lots of people travel long distances for mating, so you can, too.

Best of luck to all good and honest breeders all over the world

[tikaani]

Originally Posted by saschia

tikaani - I agree that not selling pups to Britain is not good. But on the other hand - if I have three pups, where should I sell them - somewhere they will for almost sure be used in good breeding, or somewhere where everybody does whatever they want?

On the other hand - if you have a female, you can come and mate her on the continent. Lots of people travel long distances for mating, so you can, too.

Best of luck to all good and honest breeders all over the world

problem is if people dont sell to the uk then the dogs will end up cross bread and bad quality as there is only a few blood lines over here. there are only a few people crossing them over here but unfortunatly they are all you here about as there are so few pure bread cwds here and even if people did go abroad to bread then what would be stoping them crossing the liter when the pups have grown up, that solution just wouldnt work. there are a lot of honist good people and breeeders over here, i think giving trhem a chance would be the best course of action. most people who have cross breads only have them as they couldnt have a full breed CWD now they can they would prefer to get a pur breed so that alone should stop the cross breeding....

[wolfin]

Moment, Saschia say who cann make - travel to Europa to mate, or... have this very problematic to make? If wish breed normal CSW, cann and mate in others lands.

[Navajo]

Originally Posted by tikaani

problem is if people dont sell to the uk then the dogs will end up cross bread and bad quality as there is only a few blood lines over here. there are only a few people crossing them over here but unfortunatly they are all you here about as there are so few pure bread cwds here and even if people did go abroad to bread then what would be stoping them crossing the liter when the pups have grown up, that solution just wouldnt work. there are a lot of honist good people and breeeders over here, i think giving trhem a chance would be the best course of action. most people who have cross breads only have them as they couldnt have a full breed CWD now they can they would prefer to get a pur breed so that alone should stop the cross breeding....

I disagree, there's half and quarter Czechs and Saarloos all over the place. I understand why, at the time this has happened but now both breeds are legal I see no point in it continuing.

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by saschia

tikaani - I agree that not selling pups to Britain is not good. But on the other hand - if I have three pups, where should I sell them - somewhere they will for almost sure be used in good breeding, or somewhere where everybody does whatever they want?

On the other hand - if you have a female, you can come and mate her on the continent. Lots of people travel long distances for mating, so you can, too.

Best of luck to all good and honest breeders all over the world

Hi i agree my bitch was mated in Europe, and there was nothing to stop other czech owners from doing the same thing, every time you sell a pup how do you know the person will not cross breed, how do you know they will not be cruel to the pup, you can only go visit there home and take there word for being true, other wise you would never breed,

[Navajo]

Originally Posted by saschia

tikaani - I agree that not selling pups to Britain is not good. But on the other hand - if I have three pups, where should I sell them - somewhere they will for almost sure be used in good breeding, or somewhere where everybody does whatever they want?

On the other hand - if you have a female, you can come and mate her on the continent. Lots of people travel long distances for mating, so you can, too.

Best of luck to all good and honest breeders all over the world

I agree, however what about breeding contracts, you can only breed from the bitch/dog to a pure bred bitch/dog, that means that those who want to breed pure can and the rest can forget importing a pure bred to cross.

Is AI an option in the dog world?

[tikaani]

Originally Posted by Navajo

I agree, however what about breeding contracts, you can only breed from the bitch/dog to a pure bred bitch/dog, that means that those who want to breed pure can and the rest can forget importing a pure bred to cross.

Is AI an option in the dog world?

I quite agree I would have no problem about having a contract for only breeding with uther CSD... If this meens Getting a new dogs into the country im sure most people would be happy with it and if they wernt, dont sell to them.....

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by Navajo

I agree, however what about breeding contracts, you can only breed from the bitch/dog to a pure bred bitch/dog, that means that those who want to breed pure can and the rest can forget importing a pure bred to cross.

Is AI an option in the dog world?

What is AI?

Breeding contracts are a nice thing but don´t help in the end because we talk about different countries what makes legal action very difficult. And if the contract is broken there are several mixed puppies causing more problems.

I don´t think serious people will have a problem finding new blood. But this would mean:

1. to look for good puppies all over Europe not just next door or in the next country.

2. Go to meetings, visit breeders, get informed especially in the countries of origin (and both of them) and in countries that follow their rules. Go to special Club shows with qualified judges and to bonitations.
You won´t have a problem to get new blood if people see you care for that and you will meet good breeders there.

3. Not to think that it is enough to buy a few dogs and breed in your own country. That won´t work. I you are serious to build up proper breeding you will have to travel a lot for mating, bonitations and shows. Travel to the other end of Europe when necessary, and it will be necessary very often.

4. Not to follow some "specialists" in your own country but to make up your mind and to learn by yourself, what only works following 2.

All of this will take years, a lot of time and a lot of money but for me it is the only way. I wouldn´t mind to sell a puppy to GB if I would know the person and would see he cares and knows his breed.

Ina

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by Navajo

I agree, however what about breeding contracts, you can only breed from the bitch/dog to a pure bred bitch/dog, that means that those who want to breed pure can and the rest can forget importing a pure bred to cross.

Is AI an option in the dog world?

hi steven ferguson from scotland sat in my house and signed an agreement which my wife witnessed that he would never cross bred his cwd he also signed that the dog was for him and not being sold on to third party, he cross bred the dog after 1 yr, so a contract is not worth the paper it is written on, i could go to scotland and take the dog, but then i end up in prison, the only reason i do not go and take the dog is because i have wife and two young children to think of, so if you read this steven think yourself lucky i have much to loose or i would be at your door for my dog,, it is possable to AI in uk with premission of the kennel club,,,,

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by saschia

On the other hand - if you have a female, you can come and mate her on the continent. Lots of people travel long distances for mating, so you can, too.

I agree this is one way, but I do not see any reasen to not sell CsV puppys to the UK today.

If the UK not get new CsV bood the mixing of breeds will go one or there will bee inbreeding worning on the pure CsV...

Better not sell to the breeders that you know are mixing today...

Regards / Mikael

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Hi,

before making plans about breeding purebred Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs in the UK, why don't we start using the the correct the name?
Instead of using the word "Czech", which is not quite polite to Slovak breeders and owners, the correct term "Czechoslovakian Wolfdog" or if it's too long maybe CsW would be at least a start in the right direction in the UK.
The Slovakian Republic got the patronage on the breed and without Slovakian civil breeders in the 60's and 70's the breed would not exist at all.
By the way, though it's my opinion too this proposal was made by a Slovak judge of the breed months ago.

Thanks,
Michael