MISSING credibility of the French pedigrees

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Hanka

It is a pitty in other countries exist wolfdog clubs only like clubs of friends of wolfdogs. Not really BREEDING clubs. Nobody lead breeding. Not breeding comitees. In breeding with FCI pedigree is everything with 4 legs. Not conditions for breeding dogs. If every breeding wolfdog will must have bonitation, it will be easy. Every not typicle wolfdog (in eyes of bonitation comitee)will have P14 and he will not have pups with FCI pedigree. But it is work for clubs and cooperating with dog organisations in every country.
And if owner will not agree with bonitation comitee, he must show DNA test......

I'm sorry Hanka but it is not working... First - atypical Wolfdogs DO NOT get P14... In many cases they get P1 (excellent note) even if the look and move horrible And Mutaras are the best example. Audrey Lupo Mutara - she has 0% of blood of Czechoslovakian Wolfdog; she looks like a malamute-German Shepherd cross but she passed the Czech bonitation The same was with Ave Lupo - she pased the bonitation in Jetrichovice. Not different was with other "Saarlooses" registered in Italy. Mutara Fenrir was bonitated by a Czech club judge and get NOT P14 but P3 (very good - bonitation code with almost no faults). Most of the Mutaras were already bonitated by the Czech club judges and they get PERFECT codes - best example:
http://www.wolfdog.org/eng/bonitations/122.html

Sorry but with bonitation you can not make ANYTHING against the mixes. Only DNA tests and liquidation of their pedigrees will solve the problem...

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by z Peronówki

http://www.wolfdog.org/eng/bonitations/122.html

Hmmm... And this judge are good ???

I mean, would this dogs pass a good Bonitation judge ???

Best regards / Mikael

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Hmmm... And this judge are good ???

I mean, would this dogs pass a good Bonitation judge ???

Best regards / Mikael

Mikael I understand maybe I am to young to stupid to judge now, but excelent thake for suspicious dogs and "old wolf" in judgement, like Oskar, Sonja, A.Simackova, Jedlicka, Soukupova they JUDGE who judge very long time and judge in bonitation ( a few about 20 years)....

and you quest make bonitation sense in detection suspicious dogs or not

[Mikael]

Maybe a DNA test are to be made at all Bonitations

Best regards / Mikael

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Maybe a DNA test are to be made at all Bonitations

Best regards / Mikael

I not see problem in this. this not expensive this test - very good when this make all breeder with they litter before sale puppy and see 5-10 years and we have great DNA databasa

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by wolfin

I not see problem in this. this not expensive this test - very good when this make all breeder with they litter before sale puppy and see 5-10 years and we have great DNA databasa

One Bonitation judge of 10 ... 9 to go !!!

What do you think Hanka is it possible to get the clubs to start to talk about this ???

Best regards / Mikael

[Hanka]

Everybody here knows, Jedlicka is Mutara maker and Mutara owner= mutaras heva good results. And= it is NOT czech club judge, because club does not cooperate wit him many years.
Yes, it is easy to tell "it is not possible", to write here 1000 things why it is not possible. So good, we will write here hundreds pages about terrible french mixes. It is better. Only write and do nothing.
My God......
So Ok, we will look at next and next generations of mixes and we will write how it is terrible....

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Maybe a DNA test are to be made at all Bonitations

Best regards / Mikael

And we will soon have twice as many litters from unbonitated parents, as we have now... But of course, the idea of DNA testing of every litter would be great.

[Hanka]

If you think Mutaras, it was "work " of a few people, behind back of all club. Reaction of czech club was quick. These people was kicked out from club goverment. Thanks to members of club. Now is not possible to breed these dogs and their offsprings in countries of origin. It is enough what we need. Breeding in other countries is thing of other clubs in the World. If they do nothing against mixes (not only mutaras)...............:confus ed2

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Hanka

If you think Mutaras, it was "work " of a few people, behind back of all club. Reaction of czech club was quick. These people was kicked out from club goverment. Thanks to members of club. Now is not possible to breed these dogs and their offsprings in countries of origin. It is enough what we need. Breeding in other countries is thing of other clubs in the World. If they do nothing against mixes (not only mutaras)...............:confus ed2

ah.. in this case czech club DOING nothing, when this not are in CZ republik- "not ours house not ours problem"? I good understand? niice - where did a worts about "only we protect breed, the best breeding plan, we very loove CSV"
but and in CZ are suspicious dogs who have example Galiba blood- who make in this case- or this is old problem,- and breed with this dogs today without problem?

[Rona]

Originally Posted by Hanka

If you think Mutaras, it was "work " of a few people, behind back of all club. Reaction of czech club was quick. These people was kicked out from club goverment. Thanks to members of club. Now is not possible to breed these dogs and their offsprings in countries of origin. It is enough what we need. Breeding in other countries is thing of other clubs in the World. If they do nothing against mixes (not only mutaras)...............:confus ed2

OK. So I ask again: what do you propose realistically to do, if writing is bad?

Without reliable DNA test results or certified declarations of the fraud witnesses, nothing can be done. All (except the owners ) may see the dogs look strange and do not resemble their parents, but since there are no proofs, the French Kennel Club or FCI can do nothing. BTW I don't think there is a rubric on the bonitation card called "resemblence to parents"

Since the dogs that should be tested are in hands of people who do not want or intend to conduct the tests, only hypocritically shout "we want proofs" nothing can be done except writing and warning potential buyers agaist purchasing dogs from certain kennels that have something to hide.
As you could see such economic pressure evoked fits of anger - so it seems more effective than other measures taken .