Hd - ed

[Juniorwolf]

In Denmark more and more breeders have started to give money back when owners make official HD and ED x-rays of their puppies
I really like this idea as more and more people will be encouraged to make x-rays of their dogs, which ofcourse is good for the induvidual dog/owner as he/her will know if the dog will be able do hard work/training without causing any damage to the dog or if he/her need to take extra consideration to the dogs well being, but it is also very good for the induvidual breed as monitoring the health of the breed becomes more easy and accurate and finally it is good for the induvidual breeder as he/her can monitor his/her own breeding results.

Maybe it is possible to take this one step further, by giving money back when puppies have official bonitation ? I know for one Danish breed called Broholmer, new owners have to sign a contract saying that they must make x-rays + Mental Health Test on the puppy and after x-rays and MH test they will get money back ...the amount of money giving back in Denmark is induvidual, but usually it is the same amount as the cost of HD/AD x-ray.

I wonder if breeders of our breed would think of doing the same ?
Please tell me your thoughts about this...

Greetings Rolf

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by rolf

In Denmark more and more breeders have started to give money back when owners make official HD and ED x-rays of their puppies
I really like this idea as more and more people will be encouraged to make x-rays of their dogs, which ofcourse is good for the induvidual dog/owner as he/her will know if the dog will be able do hard work/training without causing any damage to the dog or if he/her need to take extra consideration to the dogs well being, but it is also very good for the induvidual breed as monitoring the health of the breed becomes more easy and accurate and finally it is good for the induvidual breeder as he/her can monitor his/her own breeding results.

Giving money back (or part of the sum) is usual if the puppy, sold as SHOW becomes only PET Speaking about HD... well, this is a right attitude but still... Maybe a puppy didn't have proper conditions? Was overweihted? Not fed properly? Jumped a lot? We can sometimes see litters where all dogs have HD A and one has C or D...
But the idea of "paying" people for x-raying their dogs sounds interesting Isn't it better to sign an agreement when selling a puppy, that the owner will make HD before his dog is, lets say, 2 years old? If he doesn't, he pays, lets say, the club (or an animal shelter) every month, until he makes it

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by Vaiva

Giving money back (or part of the sum) is usual if the puppy, sold as SHOW becomes only PET Speaking about HD... well, this is a right attitude but still... Maybe a puppy didn't have proper conditions? Was overweihted? Not fed properly? Jumped a lot? We can sometimes see litters where all dogs have HD A and one has C or D...
But the idea of "paying" people for x-raying their dogs sounds interesting Isn't it better to sign an agreement when selling a puppy, that the owner will make HD before his dog is, lets say, 2 years old? If he doesn't, he pays, lets say, the club (or an animal shelter) every month, until he makes it

This idea with giving money back, is not about show, working or pet...
ofcourse if breeder sell a puppy which don`t live up to what it is sold as(show/working) the breeder should give some money back.
The idea is also not about proper conditions,overweight, correct food or jumping a lot, just as well as the idea have nothing to do with the results of HD/AD, the idea is ONLY to encourage the owners to make x-rays of the dog, does`nt matter the result.

If all dogs in a litter have HD A except one who have HD D, you will never know if the dog was born like this or if it is due to conditions of life(food, jumping,etc.), but if all puppies from the litter will have x-rays at least you will know the result of your breeding ...lets say litter of 8 puppies 5 puppies have HD A, 2 puppies have HD B and 1 puppy have HD D, this is still a good result, does`nt matter correct food, jumping, etc.

I don`t think it is better to let the owner pay later, because it could be problematic for the club or animal shelter to get the money, most contracts don`t have any value unless an attorney is involved and this would sometimes be expensive, what if owner sold the dog to another(for any reason) ? if owner not will be member of club, then what ? also I think it is more easy to encourage people to make x-rays, when they already did pay instead of claiming money later on

Greetings Rolf

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by rolf

In Denmark more and more breeders have started to give money back when owners make official HD and ED x-rays of their puppies
I really like this idea as more and more people will be encouraged to make x-rays of their dogs, which ofcourse is good for the induvidual dog/owner as he/her will know if the dog will be able do hard work/training without causing any damage to the dog or if he/her need to take extra consideration to the dogs well being, but it is also very good for the induvidual breed as monitoring the health of the breed becomes more easy and accurate and finally it is good for the induvidual breeder as he/her can monitor his/her own breeding results.

Maybe it is possible to take this one step further, by giving money back when puppies have official bonitation ? I know for one Danish breed called Broholmer, new owners have to sign a contract saying that they must make x-rays + Mental Health Test on the puppy and after x-rays and MH test they will get money back ...the amount of money giving back in Denmark is induvidual, but usually it is the same amount as the cost of HD/AD x-ray.

I wonder if breeders of our breed would think of doing the same ?
Please tell me your thoughts about this...

Greetings Rolf

Thanks fore bringing this up Rolf

Yes some breeders in Sweden do like that to, the new owner pay for the HD X-ray when they pick up the pupp, and get the money back after the dog has done a official x-ray after 12-24 month (depending on breed)

I plan to do like this to in the future it is better than a contract, people always wont there money back


Best regads / Mikael

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Thanks fore bringing this up Rolf

Yes some breeders in Sweden do like that to, the new owner pay for the HD X-ray when they pick up the pupp, and get the money back after the dog has done a official x-ray after 12-24 month (depending on breed)

I plan to do like this to in the future it is better than a contract, people always wont there money back


Best regads / Mikael

I am happy to hear the idea is spreading to more breeders(or future breeders) as I think it is one of the best ideas regarding monitoring the health of a breed... another bonus could be that owners the breeder normaly will lose contact with (for many reasons) will have a good reason to keep contact to the breeder, at least until the x-rays is taken

Greetings Rolf

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

We do this since our last two litters. Too many owners signed the contract saying that they will x-ray the dog but didn´t do so. We will see if this system will work out better now.

Ina

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

We do this since our last two litters. Too many owners signed the contract saying that they will x-ray the dog but didn´t do so. We will see if this system will work out better now.

Ina

This is great the idea is more wide spread than I thought...
I hope it will be more effective when people pay in advance
keep up the good work

Greetings Rolf

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by rolf

This is great the idea is more wide spread than I thought...
I hope it will be more effective when people pay in advance
keep up the good work

Greetings Rolf

Some breeders I did here let the new owner sign a contract that say they are not alowed to mix breed the dog to.

I think in Sweden a pure dog vill not be pure and lose the pedigee by Swedish kennel club roule if it is used in mixbreeding ? but it is not forbiden by law...but I think no one whit a pure CsV will take the risk ???

Is there anyone of the breeders here that do wright a contract like this before you sell your CsV puppys ???

Regards / Mikael

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Yes we do but it is very difficult in German law. The only safe way is to write a fine into the contract. We started with this with our actual litter. If you breed the dog outside the FCI or mixbreed it you have to pay several thousand Euros to us. With this mixbreedings doesn´t make sense in the financal way.

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

Yes we do but it is very difficult in German law. The only safe way is to write a fine into the contract. We started with this with our actual litter. If you breed the dog outside the FCI or mixbreed it you have to pay several thousand Euros to us. With this mixbreedings doesn´t make sense in the financal way.

Do you make the contract together with an attorney ? because there have been some kind of similar cases here in Denmark, but when the dog lives in another country, the contract is not always valid according to the law of the specific country where the dog lives, unless an attorney have made an official contract. ...In Denmark this kind of contracts is very expensive to make.

Greetings Rolf

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Some breeders I did here let the new owner sign a contract that say they are not alowed to mix breed the dog to.

I think in Sweden a pure dog vill not be pure and lose the pedigee by Swedish kennel club roule if it is used in mixbreeding ? but it is not forbiden by law...but I think no one whit a pure CsV will take the risk ???

Is there anyone of the breeders here that do wright a contract like this before you sell your CsV puppys ???

Regards / Mikael

I think this is FCI regulations, if you have a FCI. registrated kennel, you are not allowed to mix your breed with other breeds, but ofcourse accidents can happen, so if I remember this right, the breeder must report such accidents(to kennel club) and if it happens more times, some punishment will be issued ....at least this is the rules in Denmark.
But ofcourse this only apply for FCI registrated kennel-owners and does not help if the dogowner don`t have a kennel or not are member of the kennel club.

Greetings Rolf

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

Yes we do but it is very difficult in German law. The only safe way is to write a fine into the contract. We started with this with our actual litter. If you breed the dog outside the FCI or mixbreed it you have to pay several thousand Euros to us. With this mixbreedings doesn´t make sense in the financal way.

As I did hear the breeder demanded 100% of the pure puppy price for every mix breed puppy but as Rolf say it will only work if you sell the puppys in your own country...

But I got recomended to wright that if the dog lives in another country all money will go to the kennel club in that country I do not know if that will work, but the kennel club probably have a biger chans then a private kennel in another country ?

Best regads / Mikael

[WolfWhistle]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Some breeders I did here let the new owner sign a contract that say they are not alowed to mix breed the dog to.

I think in Sweden a pure dog vill not be pure and lose the pedigee by Swedish kennel club roule if it is used in mixbreeding ? but it is not forbiden by law...but I think no one whit a pure CsV will take the risk ???

Is there anyone of the breeders here that do wright a contract like this before you sell your CsV puppys ???

Regards / Mikael

In Sweden a dog will not lose its pedigree if you use it in mix-breeding. But you as a breeder might lose your kennel name and be "banned" by the Swedish kennel Club if you participate in such things. (even though you might "get away" with it the first times...)

Ninni

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by WolfWhistle

In Sweden a dog will not lose its pedigree if you use it in mix-breeding. But you as a breeder might lose your kennel name and be "banned" by the Swedish kennel Club if you participate in such things. (even though you might "get away" with it the first times...)

Ninni

OK, thanks for the info...

I think the mix breeder do not have a FCI kennel name and will not be affected at all by this

Regards / Mikael

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by WolfWhistle

In Sweden a dog will not lose its pedigree if you use it in mix-breeding. But you as a breeder might lose your kennel name and be "banned" by the Swedish kennel Club if you participate in such things. (even though you might "get away" with it the first times...)

Ninni

This is the same in Denmark ! I think it is FCI regulations ...does anybody know if it is so ?

Greetings Rolf