Breeding rules and methods

[Hanka]

Hi Ina,
do you write about leader of Czech club? Karel Skoupy? Did he promised you something and result was zero? You write about man.....
Because sometimes I don´t understand all in english language, what you write.

Other stupid articles I will not comment...................I am adult already.

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by Hanka

Hi Ina,
do you write about leader of Czech club? Karel Skoupy? Did he promised you something and result was zero? You write about man.....
Because sometimes I don´t understand all in english language, what you write.

Other stupid articles I will not comment...................I am adult already.

It doesn´t matter who it was and he doesn´t promise anything. My point was that from THAT country doing everything better than anybody else I would expect some more reaction to severe problems, not less reaction.
Ali Reolup died after the possibility of gene tests occured and after a DNA-database was started, he is in the pedigree of very many dogs, all his littermates are dead. Did you think of keeping a blood sample of him or is his DNA lost forever? How many dogs in Czech Republik are tested?

If you tell us your country is doing everthing better than anybody else you will be confronted with questions like that...

Ina

[Hanka]

No Ina, read it once again.
i wrote, I use sometimes foreign dogs for me too. But it is a pitty, they have not czech for example Hd results (of course). because i will see HJd result from our doctor and I can compare it. because in other countries can be different system. I know all doctors must conside Hd the same, but it is uthopy. Always will be differencies. and if all dogs will have the same bonitation (I mean test of character, because measuring is + - the same) I can image WHAT dog is. But a few different test of characters....I can see code about character, but I know nothing about dog, because absolutelly differernt test of charatcer.
It is not secret, my Ali was carier of dwarfism. He has it from parents- of course. I never keep it like secret. Ali was carrier like teoreticly over 3600 wolfdogs in the world - offsprings of Amur z Ďáblova kaňonu. Everybody who want or wont to know it, can ask me or all breeding commission in CZ. Nobody will keep it in scret. So why you ask me about his test???
I organised colection of blood here last year, but here was not much people which had money for it. So now we try it once again. Now is here more people which want test dogs. So my plane is to do it in spring, because will be more new owners. So where is problem? maybe next time first you can ask me what is new about tests and I answer you.
and I must tell you: only me organised it in past, nobody other. So, please, don´t write me in this tone.......
But if in all World will be minimally the same breeding rules like here, I will be happy. we will have HD, ED checked dogs, shy dogs can´t pass bonitation, somebody will watch groups of bloods, somebody will lead breeding in country.......but it is always the same...............
I don´t see other countries where all breeding dogs must have some these tests. Everybody do it only voluntarilly.
I wont help you with your problem from Havranovo, because I don´t know what happened in comunication with our club....But no, on this level no.

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Hanka

But if in all World will be minimally the same breeding rules like here, I will be happy. we will have HD, ED checked dogs,

ED? ha ha you make this if i good member only 1- or 2 years and who panic was when they mas make. In Lithuania ( oh poore, stupid country and vet) make this from 2003 years with wolfdogs.

http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showpos...76&postcount=6
(p.s. i put this info, when Hanka maybe forget about this. Sory but in CZ not are ED statistic per years.)

p.s. If I good member NOT ALL wolfdog in CZ and now make ED test, only this who want. In LT this make ALL dogs.

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Sorry Hanka but you started this tone on others first and I am not the only one that got you this way. That was the reason why I asked you back in the same manner.
And I didn´t ask about dwarfism but about DM and blood samples in DNA-databases.
Also the Czech bonitation codes are not of much use for me because of the Indices not being of consequence for the result and the kind of character test you do, that doesn´t show for me the inherited character of the dog.

So obviously we both have the same problem and should work together not against each other.

[jasmine]

Originally Posted by Hanka

No Ina, read it once again.
i wrote, I use sometimes foreign dogs for me too. But it is a pitty, they have not czech for example Hd results (of course). because i will see HJd result from our doctor and I can compare it. because in other countries can be different system. I know all doctors must conside Hd the same, but it is uthopy. Always will be differencies. and if all dogs will have the same bonitation (I mean test of character, because measuring is + - the same) I can image WHAT dog is. But a few different test of characters....I can see code about character, but I know nothing about dog, because absolutelly differernt test of charatcer.
It is not secret, my Ali was carier of dwarfism. He has it from parents- of course. I never keep it like secret. Ali was carrier like teoreticly over 3600 wolfdogs in the world - offsprings of Amur z Ďáblova kaňonu. Everybody who want or wont to know it, can ask me or all breeding commission in CZ. Nobody will keep it in scret. So why you ask me about his test???
I organised colection of blood here last year, but here was not much people which had money for it. So now we try it once again. Now is here more people which want test dogs. So my plane is to do it in spring, because will be more new owners. So where is problem? maybe next time first you can ask me what is new about tests and I answer you.
and I must tell you: only me organised it in past, nobody other. So, please, don´t write me in this tone.......
But if in all World will be minimally the same breeding rules like here, I will be happy. we will have HD, ED checked dogs, shy dogs can´t pass bonitation, somebody will watch groups of bloods, somebody will lead breeding in country.......but it is always the same...............
I don´t see other countries where all breeding dogs must have some these tests. Everybody do it only voluntarilly.
I wont help you with your problem from Havranovo, because I don´t know what happened in comunication with our club....But no, on this level no.

blablablablablablablablabla.....just wash your hands!!!!!!!!!!!
you jump to your own trap !!!!!
do you want to drop your bulshits to us??? we also deal with this breed for ages!!!!!!!

[yukidomari]

Originally Posted by Hanka

I know all doctors must conside Hd the same, but it is uthopy.

I'm sorry, this is not too important in this matter but in the USA there are 2 methods for testing hips and they are different.

Not all methods are the same, I'm not sure which are used in Europe but in the USA it is either registered with OFFA which gives rating like "Excellent" "Good", "Fair", etc. It takes a single film, and it is sent to OFFA headquarters and rated there. The animal does not need to be drugged to sleep.

Or, it is registered with PennHIP, which has PennHIP licensed vets, and they give scores by numerical rating. 3 films are taken, the animal is sleeping so the hips can be manipulated into correct position (which is painful if awake).

PennHIP in my opinion is the more accurate of the two methods, it can be done on animals as young as 16 weeks, but is best recommended to take the exam multiple times as the animal grows and take the average of the scores to 'predict' final hip score.

PennHIP was pioneered at the University of Pennsylvania Veterinary College, one of the best and foremost veterinary practices in the USA.

This is example of OFFA film:
http://www.offa.org/hd_grades.html

These are examples of PennHIP's three films:
http://research.vet.upenn.edu/pennhi...8/Default.aspx

PS - It is entirely possible for 2 vets to disagree on OFFA type film because there is an "art" of examining the film, but PennHIP type is taken by mathematical measurement.

[elf]

Originally Posted by yukidomari

I'm sorry, this is not too important in this matter but in the USA there are 2 methods for testing hips and they are different.

Not all methods are the same, I'm not sure which are used in Europe but in the USA it is either registered with OFFA which gives rating like "Excellent" "Good", "Fair", etc. It takes a single film, and it is sent to OFFA headquarters and rated there. The animal does not need to be drugged to sleep.

Or, it is registered with PennHIP, which has PennHIP licensed vets, and they give scores by numerical rating. 3 films are taken, the animal is sleeping so the hips can be manipulated into correct position (which is painful if awake).

PennHIP in my opinion is the more accurate of the two methods, it can be done on animals as young as 16 weeks, but is best recommended to take the exam multiple times as the animal grows and take the average of the scores to 'predict' final hip score.

PennHIP was pioneered at the University of Pennsylvania Veterinary College, one of the best and foremost veterinary practices in the USA.

This is example of OFFA film:
http://www.offa.org/hd_grades.html

These are examples of PennHIP's three films:
http://research.vet.upenn.edu/pennhi...8/Default.aspx

PS - It is entirely possible for 2 vets to disagree on OFFA type film because there is an "art" of examining the film, but PennHIP type is taken by mathematical measurement.

Currently a small "problem" with PennHip is the etalon value for the breed is I guess not done yet, I don't recall how many CSV are needed, maybe 20 at the beginning. The DI and HD correlation is breed dependant (I guess currently they are doing an average with GSD type):

[Rona]

Originally Posted by yukidomari

I'm sorry, this is not too important in this matter but in the USA there are 2 methods for testing hips and they are different.

We have already discussed this issue here:
http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showthread.php?t=8227

[yukidomari]

Thanks Rona!!

[jasmine]

Originally Posted by Hanka

Other stupid articles I will not comment...................I am adult already.

Adults try to be realistic and don't drop bulshits.
But through the pink glasess (that's good Daiva !!! ) the world is realy nice....BUT NOT TRUE !!!!!!!!!!!

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